The Troubleshooting and Repair for On-board Charger (OBC) Thread

[HeltElektrisk]

Hi
Norway here - same problem as most of you have reported: My 2011 C-Zero (85000 km) suddently would'nt charge at home anymore. I have no error-indications in the dispalys. The 12V battery is fine (replaced two years ago). When I plug in the homecharger I can hear the charger/fan in the car starts up, and then suddently stops charging after a few seconds. The chademo charger works fine. My dealer had a look at the car and told med there where a problem with the dc-dc converter, and that they would have to replace it with a new one, at the cost at $4500.

So o found the dc-dc converter repair-video on utube that some og you at this forum had posted and started working on my car.. But: in my case neither the fuse or the two (blue) casapitors are blown... I even replaced the two capasitors to be sure (have heard that they might be blown - even if they seems fine ont the top of them)... So: I cant find any thing on the board that seems blown/damaged in any way, - so I guess my question is if anybody have any suggestions to what else might be broken?

Im tempted to buy a used replacement dc-dc converter and just switch the whole box, - but then I need to be relatively sure that this will fix my problem...

Sorry for my bad english - and I really have no clue about electric-stuff, - so keep it simple... thanks!

 

[DBMandrake]

Any chance of getting the exact fault codes the car has logged ?

 

[HeltElektrisk]

No, I dont have a OBD-port "device"....

 

[kiev]

The On-board Chargger (OBC) is in the top chamber of the unit; below that there is a coolant chill plate in the middle layer; then in the bottom chamber is a whole other board dedicated for the DC-to-DC Converter (360VDC to 12VDC) behind the bottom lid.

This bottom chamber board may be where you have a problem, there is both an input and output fuse located on that board--let's hope it is something simple as that. There is no procedure to replace either fuse in the Factory Service Manual, but it could be easily done.

It would really help to obtain the DTC from the dealer service guy to know if the issue is in the upper or lower chamber board. Or if no OBD, then how did he arrive at this diagnosis?

Good Luck and keep us posted on how this works out for you.

 

[HeltElektrisk]

ok. Thanks. I'll see what I can do / find out and come back with my findings.

 

[imievnoob]

Hi. I have a 2012 iMiev with similar issues to what's happening here. First of all thanks to you all for creating such an great information source! Now onto the issue.

Initially the car had the orange warning light with the exclamation mark, and would not charge when the AC charger was plugged in. The red power cable indicator on the dash would flash for a few seconds then stop. It had two fault codes:
U1113 MiEV Remote CAN t/o Not equip
P0A09 DCDC Converter Fail

The main 20a 450vdc fuse was blown (and presumably the snubber caps were partly damaged)

I replaced the fuse then when turning the car to READY the snubber caps blew up properly.

I've replaced the snubber caps and now the car goes READY and had only the fault code U1113 MiEV Remote CAN t/o Not equip, but it still will not charge with the AC charger. The DCDC seems fine as there is no DTC and the 12v battery charges at 14.4v

What next step would you brilliant minds recommend? Let me know what other information you require.

Many thanks.

 

[misterbleepy]

Another thing I would check is to make sure the gear lever is properly engaging in park mode and doesn't feel "springy". If it doesn't fully engage in park this will cause the P to flash on the dashboard when the key is on and the car also will not charge. I've had that problem before too! Solved by lubricating the linkages on the left hand side of the gearbox that go to the bowden cable for the gear lever. Also probably not your issue but worth ruling out.

Thank you for posting this - car wouldn’t charge this morning, tried the granny charger, as wall box has been problematic in the past, but still wouldn’t charge.
Made myself a coffee and started reading this thread from the most recent post, with a sinking feeling that I was going to find I had a failed OBC.
Spotted this thing to check, hopped in the car and gave the shifter a quick stir, and the P showed on the dashboard and then the car started charging ok when I plugged it in.
Phew!
(I assume you mean left hand side when facing the front of the car?)

 

[DBMandrake]

Spotted this thing to check, hopped in the car and gave the shifter a quick stir, and the P showed on the dashboard and then the car started charging ok when I plugged it in.
Phew!
(I assume you mean left hand side when facing the front of the car?)

Yes.

Look under the back of the car on the left hand side of the gearbox near the driveshaft and you can't miss it - give the pivot points and ball joints for the bowden cable levers a dose of spray grease and it should be fine after working the gear lever from one end to another.

 

[misterbleepy]

Yes.

Look under the back of the car on the left hand side of the gearbox near the driveshaft and you can't miss it - give the pivot points and ball joints for the bowden cable levers a dose of spray grease and it should be fine after working the gear lever from one end to another.

Thanks - something to do when it stops raining here.

 

[kiev]

This is a continuation of troubleshooting of my failed OBC.

Previously i replaced the fuse and the blue snubber caps, but the OBC still would not function--i could plug in the EVVSE to get AC mains, the fan would come on and relays would click, then after ~15 seconds it would turn off the EVSE and throw a DTC error code.

So today i finally had some time and good weather to start back troubleshooting on my failed OBC. i removed the top board, then labelled and disconnected all the spade lugs on the bottom board, then used the diode check function of the multimeter to test all the diode junctions imbedded within the waffle plate following the schematic posted here: Waffle Plate Schematic

Everything tested good except for a shorted diode in the bottom left leg of the H-bridge shown as "Lower Right" in the schematic.

Now to consider how this plays for OBC failure-- was this the root cause of failure or the resulting damage from a blown fuse or the snubber caps?

 

[coulomb]

Now to consider how this plays for OBC failure--

And also how to repair an IGBT in the Waffle Plate™. Layout (for minimizing inductance and maximizing heat sinking) is probably too important to have something external grafted on. Plus, the IGBT probably failed shorted, and so needs to be removed from the circuit. Even if a drain or source lead fused open circuit, you'd probably want to remove the dead IGBT so it didn't add to gate-source capacitance.

I have a Nissan Laef now, but it turns out that they also have a Nichicon charrger, a bit different in detail (e.g. one large can capacitor in place of 3 PFC PCB capacitors), but similar in broad terms, I believe. Evidence is starting to trickle in of Leaf OBC failures, though I suspect they are nowhere near as prevalent as iMiEV OBC failures.

[ Took a laef from Kiev's book to defeat the stupid auto-links. ]

 

[kiev]

i've tried digging thru the epoxy on a waffle plate and it is very difficult--likely an impossible repair. Easier to replace the entire plate and even that is not easy. i imagine they mount the plate to the heat sink, then mount the bottom board, then do the soldering in place.

Coincidentally i've obtained a Laef also. Now i'm looking at how to identify and replace a bad cell(s)--the full charge range is showing 19 miles. But it's a fully loaded car with only 45k miles, always garage kept, new tires and in otherwise perfect condition.

i hope the laef nichicon charggers are more robust and you get many EV smiles with your car.

 

[Kentril]

Hello all, I'm having a similar problem as ChristopheFR in this http://myimiev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=4079&start=160#p37320

I have Citroen C-Zero 71km run from FR/JP
After 14 days stays outside in hot weather I came up to my car, and not charging.

Diagnosis: When I plug my charging cable, the green charging light on the cable box comes on for several seconds, I hear a few clicks to the cable and to the car, the car's blower starts a few seconds, then everything stops, no blower, ONLY green light on the cable, and no-fault on the cable or on the dashboard. Seems car is fully charged but apparently not.

Rapid Charging is working perfectly (even to 100 %)
12V Seems has 13V. It hasn't been replaced for 4 years.
The car is driving without any problems.
I bought a new DCDC charger (Is it the 220V charger, right?). But the problem persists.

The dealer told me the Main charging board unit is gone. He needs more money for analysing. He says the price 2500 USD

Could be pre-charged resistors? as said in this post http://myimiev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=4079&start=170#p37324


Anyway, I would try:

• Get from OBSD link any error codes - or I hope can get it from the dealer
  Try to replace 12V Battery - is it possible to connect it to the charger?
  Test if the fuse is ok - how to recognize if the fuse is gone?

Are the parts the same for Peugeot Ion, Citroen C-Zero and iMiev?
Do you have any suggestion about where to buy parts?

Thank you very much for any advice.

Jiri

 

[kiev]

Howdy Jiri,

Sorry to hear of your problem, failure of OBC is happening all too often.

Christophe was never able to repair or fix his original problem--he bought a used charger that was also failed, but was able to replace the Output snubber capacitors and get it working. His original board was failed on the AC input side and likely blew components within the epoxy-coated waffle plate located below the bottom board, which is not possible to repair.

Since your car runs and keeps the 12-Volt battery charged, we can say that your 20A fuse is okay, and the DC-DC converter board in the bottom plenum of the OBC is okay.

From your description, i suspect that you have either a failure of the output snubbers or something blown on the AC input side. Hopefully no damage within the waffle plate. Review the pictures of the internal layout of other boxes, then open your OBC and inspect and take pictures.

Good Luck to you,
kenny

 

[DBMandrake]

Sorry if this has been posted already in this very long thread, but I stumbled across a nice hands on video of the typical DC/DC inverter capacitor and fuse replacement repair on youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63ZWosSyq7Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynFKclou-LI

Very handy for anyone contemplating doing this repair. Nice that there is also thanks given to this forum at the end of the second video.

One question I have about the two capacitors that fail - now that we know there is a service bulletin about this issue (in the US anyway, not here in the UK sadly) and that it says that the capacitors have "low durability", what does that really mean ?

Does it mean:

a) The capacitors themselves are fine but were underspec'ed for the job, for example too low a voltage rating, or wrong type of dielectric ?
b) The capacitors were spec'ed correctly but there was a bad batch of capacitors fitted in a date range that don't live up to their ratings ?

The reason I ask is, what are you guys replacing them with ? If you are just fitting direct equivalents with the same ratings and the problem was that the originals were underspec'ed, that would presumably lead to eventual failure again ?

Would it be wise to replace them with a higher rated capcitor, particullay in relation to voltage rating, dielectic matieral and thermal rating ? Do we know what the cause of failure is ? I'm presuming it's high voltage breakdown of the insulation ?

 

[misterbleepy]

Does it mean:

a) The capacitors themselves are fine but were underspec'ed for the job, for example too low a voltage rating, or wrong type of dielectric ?
b) The capacitors were spec'ed correctly but there was a bad batch of capacitors fitted in a date range that don't live up to their ratings ?

The reason I ask is, what are you guys replacing them with ? If you are just fitting direct equivalents with the same ratings and the problem was that the originals were underspec'ed, that would presumably lead to eventual failure again ?

Would it be wise to replace them with a higher rated capcitor, particullay in relation to voltage rating, dielectic matieral and thermal rating ? Do we know what the cause of failure is ? I'm presuming it's high voltage breakdown of the insulation ?

I don't have answers to a) and b), but it would be great if someone else did.

I went for a much higher voltage range on the ones I bought to replace my blown ones - the ones I bought (from Farnell in the UK - order code 1823305) are rated at 6.3kV.

 

[Virusman]

Hi guys, I need help.
During desoldering I broke one of the capacitors.
See photo:


Value of capacitance will be great, at least color of the capacitor.
Name of IC304 also will be helpfull.
Best regards.

 

[kiev]

The component that you have circled is actually a resistor on my board, and is marked "331", which measures 330 Ohms.

The IC304 is marked "277 147", which i think is an Op Amp such as the TLC277 from TI. i don't see any vendor marks on the chip. IC301 and IC311 are also this same chip.

Did your ic304 get damaged during desoldering of the waffle plate?

Let us know what you find with your OBC, i'm guessing it was failed for you to be so deep into the board.

 

[Virusman]

Hi, thanks for your reply it's very helpfull.

4,7Ohm resistor was broken, and someone before me replace blue caps.
I'm not a user of this charger so I'm not sure if that is everythink.
My customer didn't give me any additional information.

Best regards

 

[Easky15]

Evening all, I'm here as i'm trying to fix a 2011 Citroen C-Zero which has a problem with this now famous circuit board,
First thing i noticed on this is 2 cracked ceramic resistors the smaller 7K one looks a bit worse, apart from that no other visible signs of damage.

I've removed all the rubber potting material from around the 2 resistors and de-soldered one complete side of the "waffle plate" and have it half removed, will finish it tomorrow so i have better access to the solder points holding the resistors in place,

My question is does this fault sound familiar to anyone and if so is there anything else i should test.

Also now that i will have good access to all common failing components should i just go ahead and replace them all for fresh/upgraded components or is it a case of "if it's not broke don't fix it"??

Lastly is there a recommended source for buying components as i do NOT want to buy cheap parts and end up needing to remove that waffle plate a second time,

Couldn't see how to add images here on this site so here is a link to some on my google drive
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1FzvQCT5Ydkf5JHW3b547jEiLObPikOqa