Not Charging. Main Inverter Fuse blown

[iDriver]

Edit: This post is incorrect. The main charging unit is the issue
No, I don't have a ChadiMo

So I got a new traction pack about a year ago, under warranty. Everything has been great. Then, last week, I plugged in and charged the car from 1 bar to full. It had been a long time since the car had been that empty, but figured this would be a great chance to do a re-balance. Car charged up all the way, no problem there. However, when I went out to drive it the next day, it had the 12volt alert and the :!: over the car lights lit up on the dash.

However, the car still drove! OK, well that's weird. I'll go get some coffee and see if it goes away. 12 miles later, light is still on. Fine, I'll plug it back in and see what happens. Oh NO! It won't charge!! quickly tested with 2 other EVSE units (yes, I have 3), nope will not start charging. What the heck is going on??

Ok, I test the 12volt, it's not charging when the car is "Ready". Well that's strange, so I pull it and take it to AutoZone and they test it. It's fine. It's only about 70% full, but it's healthy. Damn. Ok, now what?

At this point, I gave up and had it towed to the dealership I trust to handle the issue with this car. I'm also freaking out! Because I'm concerned it's the onboard charger, and I've heard that can be wildly expensive to replace. Car is over 5 years old and has 60,682 Miles on it, so I'm screwed if it's the charger.

Edit: Here is the wrong info:
5 days later, I get good news. It's the Fuse in the Main Charging Inverter. It's $19.20 and on it's way from Japan. Score! The bad news, they said it's a 3 hour labor charge to change it, so I'm out $480. Fine! I'll live.

Anyway, if you have this issue, don't do what I did and panic right away. It might just be the fuse and you're good to go.

 

[sandange]

There is a Facebook group ( i-miev en francais) in French that recently reported a similar situation , in short
a diagnosis of a MCU needing replacement for some astronomical cost and eventually discovered and replaced a blown fuse .
He has been driving for several weeks now with out any problems .
He has been warned that this may not last and that the MCU needs to be changed.
They offered him a new MCU at a discount but still outrageously priced.

If you read french or want to follow them here's the Link to the facebook group discussion
https://www.facebook.com/groups/iMi...=1511743982039552&notif_t=group_comment_reply

 

[Don]

I believe we had a recall for some USA models to replace the MCU - Maybe these problems are what led to that recall??

Don

 

[iDriver]

Well, bad news, the fuse blew again. Now they want to replace the MCU. And you're right, the cost is and outrageous $4800.

Need help! What should I do? the car is over 5 years old (less than 6) and has 60,680 miles on it, so I'm out of warranty. I'm desperate here. Does anyone know where I could get a used MCU?

 

[kiev]

i would replace the 12V battery--for an EV there is no such thing as a "good" 70% charged 12V battery.

Did the fuse blow immediately when you turned the key to START, or did it happen while driving?

If at START, then i doubt that your MCU is bad--the most likely culprit is a defective precharge resistor located inside the pack. The huge in-rush current into the main capacitor in the MCU would blow that fuse if the cap was allowed to connect directly to the pack voltage without a pre-charge. You could easily replace the fuse yourself and give it another try. The 12V battery is what supplies the power to energize the contactors inside the pack, so if it was weak then the contacts could bounce and the pre-charge may not have occurred properly--hence my recommend to replace the aux battery. There should have been a DTC for the aux battery when they connected the MUT.

If it happened later while driving then there should be a trouble code. Did they read the DTCs during the previous visit? Get the MUT printout of the trouble codes from the dealer and post it up here and we can troubleshoot it.

If you find a used one then i would be interested to buy your "bad" one and fix it. If you can't find a used one then PM me if you want to have it repaired.

 

[iDriver]

@Kiev, thank you so much for your response! It really means a lot to me. I will contact the dealer and get the codes and post them. Until then here is what I know.

First the Aux battery, is less than a year old. I did hook it up to a battery charger and charge it to full, to make sure the low state of charge on it wasn't causing an issue. However, I did not replace it. I will ask the dealership if they've tried a new battery.

Fuse: I do not know if it blew during start. Just that I got in the car, started it, and had this issue. I will contact the dealer and see when it blew for them.

Charging main battery issue: This is the key issue. When I connect to Level 2 or 1, I can hear the contacts start clicking, then very quickly the charge cycle aborts.

I will update you right away when I hear anything. And yes, I'm totally willing to let you have a crack at it before I dump $5k on it. I'm sure we can work something out. More to follow.

 

[iDriver]

No luck. The fuze pops while charging the car. So it looks like I'll be buying a replacement. Merry (expletive deleted by moderator) Christmas to me. :x

@Kiev, i'm having them give me the old one. I'll send it to you if you'd like to check it out. Any other advice or help would be appreciated. Thanks again.

 

[JoeS]

iDriver, sorry to hear, and I'm sorry you don't have a backup vehicle to use while you scrounge around for a cost-effective solution.

The horrible replacement cost of the MCU, just as the cost of the air conditioning compressor, puts into serious jeopardy the viability of our i-MiEVs in the long run without a source for reasonably-priced used parts. All those wrecked i-MiEVs that have been purchased by unknown buyers - whatever happens to them?

iDriver, thank you for your continued inputs and do let us know how and at what cost this finally gets resolved.

Edit: I just sent an email to Pick-n-Pull asking them why they don't have the i-MiEV listed in their pulldown menu.

 

[iDriver]

Thanks JoeS. I've been scrounging around trying to find a used one for almost a week now. Nothing.

What I really want to know is, what went wrong with the current one? I bet it's actually nothing expensive to fix at all, but it's much easier for them to simply force you to replace the whole unit, rather than actually have someone on staff who is trained to truly troubleshoot these things and replace the capacitor, or control board, or whatever-ma-jobber that's the real problem.

Anyway, my wife and I have decided to just go ahead and get the job done. I still have a year of payments left, an if I get another 6 years out of this one, I'll be fine.

After this, I'm not buying an Electric Car from a traditional car manufacturer again. The existing dealership model, and state of ability/knowledge in their service departments, has a long long way to go. If I had know that the MCU would cost this much, I honestly would not have purchased the car. It's truly senseless. No car should have a single part that costs this much on it. Certainly not a car at this price point. Live and learn I guess. Sometimes cheap gets expensive....

I'll let you know how things shake out, and if someone wants to take a crack at fixing the broken MCU, you're welcome to it. I won't need it back anytime soon, and if it turns out to be something simple, we'll all be better off knowing that.

 

[Don]

What I really want to know is, what went wrong with the current one? I bet it's actually nothing expensive to fix at all, but it's much easier for them to simply force you to replace the whole unit, rather than actually have someone on staff who is trained to truly troubleshoot these things and replace the capacitor, or control board, or whatever-ma-jobber that's the real problem.

Most all high tech things are replaced in this same manner. If they are repaired at all, it's done in a central location (no doubt Japan in this case) where a skilled technician with special fixtures, jigs and tools *and* test equipment troubleshoots and replaces the defective parts. To maintain anything like that at a dealership would not be cost effective. When they change out a battery pack, they have to get special tools and lifts shipped to the dealer to do the job and I suspect the only reason they do that at the dealers is because it's cheaper than shipping the car to a central location

Don

 

[wmcbrine]

After this, I'm not buying an Electric Car from a traditional car manufacturer again. The existing dealership model, and state of ability/knowledge in their service departments, has a long long way to go.

Teslas cost even more...

 

[1pk]

There's an MCU on Ebay right now

https://www.ebay.com/itm/New-OEM-Mitsubishi-EV-Motor-Control-Unit-9410A092-I-MIEV/112579937859?epid=2270741073&hash=item1a36498643:g:OekAAOSwtqtZy-oA&vxp=mtr

 

[kiev]

Looks like a bargain at $1799. compared to the dealer price.

i would like to take a look at fixing your "bad" one.

kenny

 

[sandange]

There is one I Miev here in Quebec, Canada for sale on the internet
classified adds called Kijiji ( like craigs list)
It's selling for parts claiming a MCU failure. Ad ID 1301942854
4,500 Canadian dollars = aprox 3,500 USD

https://www.kijiji.ca/v-autos-camio...to/1301942854?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true

Also the other Miev that just had the main fuse replaced is still operating fine since the replacement – both models were 2012’s

 

[kiev]

No luck. The fuze pops while charging the car. So it looks like I'll be buying a replacement. Merry (expletive deleted by moderator) Christmas to me. :x

@Kiev, i'm having them give me the old one. I'll send it to you if you'd like to check it out. Any other advice or help would be appreciated. Thanks again.

It's really odd that it blows the fuse to the inverter while charging--i wouldn't have guessed that power was applied to the inverter at that time, can't see any reason why it would be needed or desired.

Yes indeed i would like to see if the main capacitor aka condenser is shorted.

 

[iDriver]

They're doing the work right now. I'll let you know how it goes.

 

[Aerowhatt]

They're doing the work right now. I'll let you know how it goes.

Looking forward to your report on this!

Reminds me, even though the dealer price for this "repair" is obscene! It's not any different for an ICE. Way back in 1990 I had a piston Gaul on my (bought new for $9,000) 1986 Jeep comanche. After a lot of calls and finagling I was able to get the engine pulled, rebuilt and reinstalled for ~ $3,600.00 by third party vendors. The dealers service estimate was much higher of course, but still I spent an awful lot to keep the truck from staying a paper weight. Automatic transmissions are famous for costing thousands to repair when they act up too. Nothing right/reasonable about any of it! But the fact is that any car is a money pit, some shallower, some deeper. The electronics on EV's have always worried me longevity wise. But again, the electronics on modern ICE's are extensive too and the vehicle will not function if they act up either.

Aerowhatt

 

[kiev]

@iDriver

here is a picture of inside the high-voltage part of the MCU, showing the small fuse circled in red, and the big capacitor that connects to the pack + and - terminals. The orange cable at the top is the feed line from the charger to the fuse on the + terminal to the pack (and capacitor). The fuse is marked "PEC 20A 450VDC". To the right of the fuse is a 15W 58k bleed resistor that drains the capacitor when the key is switched off. If the resistor were internally shorted it could also blow the fuse.

In this picture you can see the IGBT 6-pack under the capacitor. There are 3 circuit boards that route signals to control both the top and bottom transistors for one motor phase. There are 3 motor phases and the wiring is designated by color B, W, R.

Here is an IGBT under the green circuit board showing the silicon dies of the totem pole and the high current buss bars. If something failed here it would be clearly visible during disassembly. Good luck, i hope they get your car fixed. Maybe we can fix the old MCU if that is the location of the problem, but it could very well be in the charger. The fuse is the symptom, but the issue is elsewhere. The DTCs should be used to diagnose and troubleshoot the failure.

 

[JoeS]

Kenny, thank you so much for posting and discussing these photos. Nothing appears to have cooked, and, starting with the simplest, presumably you've checked both the capacitor and resistor and they're ok? I'd be inclined to apply 400v to that cap (recognizing our i-MiEV only gets up to 360vdc) and let it sit for a while to see if it holds the charge. Edit: Maybe also heat it and freeze it to see if it hiccups.

Appreciate your analysis, all slowly adding to our body of knowledge about our cars. Do let us know if you make any progress.

 

[Antaris]

My I is in the shop and they say they have another with the same error code. A fuse is on the way and should be installed Monday. The sales guy at the dealership says that since 2012 they have sold 72 units. It makes sense to me that some business in North America would figure out how to repair the components. I have talked with an engineer locally that repairs cnc electronics and owns one of the competitors electric cars.
Hopefully he can help me if Mitsu chokes.