Duosida EVSE

[Don]

The guy in Gilbert AZ who is selling the Duosida aftermarket EVSE for $200 on ebay and CL states that the charger in the car tells the EVSE what rate to operate on L1.

That's not correct. The charger in the car can operate up to about 14 amps on either L1 or L2, but only if the EVSE tells it that it's safe to operate with that much current. Your EVSE is telling the charger it can only provide 8 amps, so the charger is regulated to just 8 amps. Use an EVSE rated for 12 amps and you'll recharge at 12 amps

If he is correct, then putting a EVSE that wants to run at 12A on 120V will not be a successful enterprise.

Ignore what he's telling you - Any EVSE set to operate at 12 amps will have your car (and any other compatible EV) charging at 12 amps

He states that his chevy volt has a dashboard switch or way to choose 8 or 12A on L1 and that if the mitsu charger is set to draw 8, that will be the limit. This is at odds with what you all say on here but I am more inclined to go along with the wisdom here.

He is correct that the 8/12 switch in his Volt would only work at 8 amps if he was using your EVSE. The car can't charge using more amps than the EVSE is rated for, but if the EVSE is rated for 12, his Volt can select either 8 or 12

Long ago you read here about others using various EVSE's set to 6, 8, 10 or 12 amps charging 2012 iMiEV's. What makes you think a 12 amp EVSE won't charge your car at 12 amps . . . . other than the misinformation this guy has told you?

HOW FAST AN EV RECHARGES IS SET BY THE EVSE SUPPLYING THE POWER - THE CAR CAN USE ANY NUMBER OF AMPS UP TO THAT MAXIMUM NUMBER IS CHOOSES . . . . BUT NOT MORE
Plug any brand of EVSE set for 12 amps and your car will charge at 12 amps. The Duosida EVSE will charge your car at max on both L1 and L2, so if that's what you decide to buy, don't worry

 

[JoeS]

Up until now, on 120vac all the EVSEs we've been dealing with have themselves only allowed a maximum current draw of 12A, which, at 80%, is the maximum allowable steady-state current draw from a conventional 120vac 15A (NEMA 5-15) circuit.

For this reason, we have not been concerned with higher currents on 120vac.

This Duosida EVSE evidently is pre-set to allow 16A (irrespective of whether it's 120vac or 240vac) and requires a 20A source circuit.

Does anyone know what is the maximum current draw by the i-MiEV on 120vac if the input current is unrestricted by the EVSE ?

Note: we do know that the maximum current draw by the i-MiEV charger on 240vac is around 13A.

 

[thomash85715]

The vendor for this Duosida is being a bit circumspect about the max rate at L1 hooked to i-MiEV. I totally go with your analysis Don and was mainly just repeating what was just misinformation supplied by this other person to confirm that it was indeed wrong. When I pressed him about what the L1 amp rate would really be on my car, he replied: "forget about L1. Just use L2."
So now I put the question to our group: has anyone put a cheap aftermarket duosida EVSE on their i-MiEV and achieved good L1 results? Would I be the first to try this?

 

[wmcbrine]

Does anyone know what is the maximum current draw by the i-MiEV on 120vac if the input current is unrestricted by the EVSE ?

I've been told that it's 16 amps. Not verified by me.

16 amps is also supposed to be the max for Level 1 charging according to the j1772 specs. But apparently that limit is widely ignored.

 

[JoeS]

wmcbrine, thank you for the link - I had forgotten about that thread.

So, if the i-MiEV can draw 16A and the Duosida is fixed to pass-through 16A, then thomash85715 had darn well better have a good 20A protected circuit. Sorry, but plugging the Duosida into a 15A circuit and the car drawing 16A steady-state is asking for trouble - this is what happened at 120vac 16A feeding a Zivan charger (nothing to do with the i-MiEV) -

thomash85715, don't you have 240vac available?

 

[thomash85715]

I would not go above 12A. I have a kill a watt at the ready to keep eye on things should I actually get this thing from CZ and build it. I have worked in electronics at TV stations where serious considerations to power flow and dissipation are part of the knowledge base.
Going to L2 for me is complicated. First of all I see no method for L2 for me other than the $300 evse upgrade or the $200+ duosida. And then I would have more work and wiring to do at my carport and adjacent laundry room. This enhanced level 1 DIY device is appealing on many levels to me. It is a fraction of the cost of convert to L2, it is usable at other people's normal outlets should I visit someone. It gives me a feeling of control over my own charging situation instead of just paying other people to run my show. And it speeds charging up from a 120V existing plug. That is assuming it works as advertised.

 

[Don]

I would not go above 12A. I have a kill a watt at the ready to keep eye on things . . . . .

I think Joe's warning was if you bought the Duosida which is set for 16 amps L1 and doesn't appear to be adjustable. If you were to buy that you wouldn't be able to limit it to 12 amps even if you wanted to

If your plans are to keep the car for a long time, the EVSE Upgrade is not a bad deal. If you have electrical knowledge (and you say you do) converting an existing outlet from 120 volts to 240 volts isn't that difficult and it's really inexpensive to do. If your laundry room is near your carport, it's usually pretty simple to get 240 by tapping into the dryer circuit - You may not be able to charge and dry clothes at the same time, but that's not a big deal. It is also possible to recharge with 240 volts by using two 120 volt outlets which are fed by different phases. Stick one lead of your voltmeter on the 'hot' pin of both outlets - You'll either get zero volts (if both outlets are on the same phase) or 240 volts if the two hot pins are fed by opposite phases. You make up a junction box with a pair of 120 volt cords which plug into the outlets and you get 240 volts out of the box to feed your EVSE

The nice thing about the EVSE Upgrade is you can take it with you anywhere and with a set of pigtails you can recharge just about anywhere, from any type of outlet, many times using 240 volts. A $10 or $15 pigtail will allow you to plug it into just about any electrical outlet, anywhere

Don

 

[justoneman]

A guy in Gilbert AZ on ebay is offering the duosida for $200 though I can't tell if has them or is backordering or what. I put a question to him asking if it is user programmable for various amps on 120vac. Not answered yet.
One thing I don't get though...is a US early i-miev limited to 8 amp charge by some setting in the EVSE it came with or is it something in its onboard charger commanding the EVSE to stay at 8? I believe I have seen statements on here and elsewhere the canadian cars charge at 12A from 120vac sockets. Which box is that happening in? Point is that if it is programmed into our USA chargers, then a duosida is not going to do anything but charge at 8A on a USA car. What am I missing here?

I have a Duosida EVSE. Its a 16amp 240. It has a 20 amp plug type I have the 20 amp outlet type. I made a 10AWG extension for it and a conversion whip to use on a standard 10amp outlet type. It seems to charge pretty fast for me at both of my charging locations with these two different outlet types. Its waterproof and I am very happy with its performance.

 

[justoneman]

 

[justoneman]

 

[JoeS]

I have a Duosida EVSE. Its a 16amp 240. It has a 20 amp plug type I have the 20 amp outlet type. I made a 10AWG extension for it and a conversion whip to use on a standard 10amp outlet type....

justoneman, thanks for this input and the photos. I'm a bit confused: when you say you made a "conversion whip to use on a standard 10 amp outlet" -
1) By "conversion whip" I assume you're talking about a connector adapter, with one end the 240vac NEMA 6-20R (to mate the the Duosida 6-20P) and the other end is the NEMA 5-20P (the yellow connector in your photo going into the 120vac 20A outlet)?
2) The US standard 120vac outlet is 15A, with a maximum allowable steady-state current of 12A. What is this "standard 10 amp outlet" you're talking about?
3) The Duosidada limits the current to 16A. Is there any way you can measure this 120vac current so we can confirm once and for all what current the car really draws? All the other EVSEs limit the 120vac current to 12A.

 

[Don]

If you plug an EVSE rated at 16 amps into a 10 amp outlet, I would think the car would charge at the max amperage it can do (it's getting a signal from the EVSE that 16 amps is OK) and if the car wanted more than 10 amps, you would blow your 10 amp fuse, or trip your 10 amp breaker?

Don

 

[justoneman]

I have a Duosida EVSE. Its a 16amp 240. It has a 20 amp plug type I have the 20 amp outlet type. I made a 10AWG extension for it and a conversion whip to use on a standard 10amp outlet type....

justoneman, thanks for this input and the photos. I'm a bit confused: when you say you made a "conversion whip to use on a standard 10 amp outlet" -
1) By "conversion whip" I assume you're talking about a connector adapter, with one end the 240vac NEMA 6-20R (to mate the the Duosida 6-20P) and the other end is the NEMA 5-20P (the yellow connector in your photo going into the 120vac 20A outlet)?
2) The US standard 120vac outlet is 15A, with a maximum allowable steady-state current of 12A. What is this "standard 10 amp outlet" you're talking about?
3) The Duosidada limits the current to 16A. Is there any way you can measure this 120vac current so we can confirm once and for all what current the car really draws? All the other EVSEs limit the 120vac current to 12A.

Yes you are correct. I made a connector adapter, so that I could use the unit at my work which has a standard 110 outlet. What I showed in the photo is my "extension cord" I made so my car could be charged outside of the garage. I am sure you are correct 12a steady current.

 

[JoeS]

I've tried to consolidate all the Duosida posts into this new thread. Another example of why we shouldn't combine subjects in our posts. If I missed some Duosida posts in this transfer, please let me know via a PM. My reason for doing this is to focus on this particular EVSE and to flag a potentially dangerous situation using the Duosida EVSE on a 15A 120vac outlet (if someone makes the wrong adapter).

 

[justoneman]

I've tried to consolidate all the Duosida posts into this new thread. Another example of why we shouldn't combine subjects in our posts. If I missed some Duosida posts in this transfer, please let me know via a PM. My reason for doing this is to focus on this particular EVSE and to flag a potentially dangerous situation using the Duosida EVSE on a 15A 120vac outlet (if someone makes the wrong adapter).

This is dangerous? What I am doing is dangerous?

 

[Don]

Your EVSE is telling the car it's OK for the car to draw 16 amps! - If you plug it into an outlet which cannot supply 16 amps, when the car sets it's charger to draw 16 amps, something bad is about to happen . . . .

Don

 

[JoeS]

...My reason for doing this is to focus on this particular EVSE and to flag a potentially dangerous situation using the Duosida EVSE on a 15A 120vac outlet (if someone makes the wrong adapter).

This is dangerous? What I am doing is dangerous?

You are not doing anything dangerous, as you are using a 20A connector on a 20A circuit, and the maximum current that the Duosida allows is 16A.

I wrote "if someone makes the wrong adapter" and plugged that Duosida into a 15A circuit.

Since you are the only person to have a Duosida, could you perhaps measure the current being drawn by the i-MiEV? Enquiring minds would like to know...

 

[justoneman]

...My reason for doing this is to focus on this particular EVSE and to flag a potentially dangerous situation using the Duosida EVSE on a 15A 120vac outlet (if someone makes the wrong adapter).

This is dangerous? What I am doing is dangerous?

You are not doing anything dangerous, as you are using a 20A connector on a 20A circuit, and the maximum current that the Duosida allows is 16A.

I wrote "if someone makes the wrong adapter" and plugged that Duosida into a 15A circuit.

Since you are the only person to have a Duosida, could you perhaps measure the current being drawn by the i-MiEV? Enquiring minds would like to know...

As mentioned in the other thread. I have identified the circuit of my garage outlet and it is indeed a 15 amp not a 20. So someone has installed a 20 outlet on that circuit.

How would I go about measuring the current being drawn by the I-MiEV ?

 

[JoeS]

The most common and quite versatile device for measuring a whole bunch of parameters is the Kill-A-Watt, but the problem is that it has a maximum current of 15A. I've seen these for as low as $15.
http://www.p3international.com/products/p4400.html

I did a brief eBay search and found, for example, this thing that would do the job:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-80-260V-...y-Meter-Panel-Voltmeter-Ammeter-/182448260980

There are lots of ac clamp-on meters out there that should also work, but they're usually part of a fairly fancy multimeter. You don't need something with high accuracy for what we're trying to do. A clamp-on meter does as it's name implies: it clamps around one of the power wires. For example, here's a $22 unit:
https://www.amazon.com/XCSOURCE-Mul...coding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=X6MSRTTCTZFYV9VZ39AK

 

[kiev]

How would I go about measuring the current being drawn by the I-MiEV ?

The best way would be to purchase an LX OBDlink dongle for $50 from scantool.net and download the free android app, Canion, to monitor the voltage and current of the pack. It must be the real scantool device using the STN1110 chip, not a fake one on ebay using the ELM327 chip which won't work. You will link to the dongle with Bluetooth and it will send the data to your phone. There is a big thread devoted to Canion on this forum.