Charging two i-Mievs

[TobyGadd]

After a couple of years of enjoying our first i-Miev, we just bought our second one. So, now we need to charge them, hopefully at the same time.

I've mostly been using the 8-amp option on the charger, which works great overnight. With a second car, the easiest option seems to be to just plug both of them into the same outlet--which would draw 16 amps. But, if I recall correctly, most houses have 15-amp circuits--although I've heard that newer houses (ours was built in 2000), have 20-amp wiring in the walls.

Thoughts on how to proceed?

Edit: I'm in Colorado, so 120V outlets.

 

[kiev]

If you are trying to use the same outlet, first check the electrical panel to determine which breaker controls that outlet and determine if there are any other outlets on that circuit.

Then determine if it is a 15-Amp or 20-Amp breaker?

lf 20, and there are no other outlets or possible loads on that branch, then two 8-Amp EVSSE units at the same time would be hitting the max capacity rating for the circuit (80% of 20A= 16A).

If it's a 15, then two at the same time would exceed the max rating (80% of 15A = 12A).

Good Luck with the twins,

 

[jray3]

Charging two cars EVen with the 8 amp EVSEs on a single circuit would be running a 20 amp circuit at it's absolute maximum (derate by 20% for a continuous load). My household now has two electric daily drivers (we added a 2016 Kia SOUL EV), and though I had fretted about coming up with two L2 EVSE or a load-sharing dual-headed EVSE, it's working just fine with one 32 amp L2 and one 12 amp L1 EVSE. Our vehicle usage is different each day, but whichever car has the greater need takes L2 and ensures that the other car gets plugged in on L1. Three months now without a car coming up short on charge.

 

[TobyGadd]

Thanks kiev! Seems like the best solution is just to add other circuit.

 

[Don]

If your circuit has no other loads . . . . and if the breaker is a 20 amp one . . . . then that means for sure the wire in the wall is 12 gauge and running them both on the same outlet really poses no problem - Both the breaker and the wire can handle more than 16 amps, but for safety's sake, we always de-rate a 20 amp circuit by 20% just to ensure a safe margin for continuous use . . . . and charging cars is a continuous use - Even if you were drawing 18 amps instead of 16, both the wire and the breaker would handle it, but it's not recommended for a use like this. I would advise at the very least you replace that outlet with a quality, hospital grade outlet before you begin using it to support the 16 amp load

If you do decide to install another outlet, I would advise you to make it a 240 volt outlet, assuming you have room in your panel for a new double breaker, with either 20 or 30 amp breakers - 20 for 12 gauge wire, 30 for 10 gauge wire. That opens up many other charging possibilities, both now and in the future

Don

 

[TobyGadd]

Thanks Don!

I think that I'm going to add a Clipper Creek L2 charger. It'll make it possible to pre-heat one of the cars in the morning, as well as getting a faster charge when needed. I was hoping that I didn't need to call an electrician, but I think that this will be the most flexible and best approach.

 

[WReed82]

Hi Toby,

IF that is the ONLY outlet on that breaker, AND it has 12ga wiring,
an electrician could easily convert it to 240V, 20A(derated to 16A) using the existing 12ga wiring.
The white neutral wire would be marked at each end with red tape and labeled HOT.

At max charge rate our Maeve pulls about 13.5A, so well within the 16A limit.

Good health, Weogo

 

[TobyGadd]

Hi Toby,

IF that is the ONLY outlet on that breaker, AND it has 12ga wiring,
an electrician could easily convert it to 240V, 20A(derated to 16A) using the existing 12ga wiring.
The white neutral wire would be marked at each end with red tape and labeled HOT.

At max charge rate our Maeve pulls about 13.5A, so well within the 16A limit.

Good health, Weogo

This is cool. Thanks Weogo, I'll check into it!

 

[Don]

Also, you can have your OEM Panasonic EVSE 'upgraded' to 12 amps and it will do 12 amps on either 120 volts L1 or on 240 volts L2. Since the car uses less than 14 amps on L2, an upgraded EVSE will charge at better than 90% of the maximum possible . . . . and, if you need to use L1, it will provide 12 amps instead of the usual 8, which is a 50% increase. Handy even if you do eventually buy some other L2 EVSE. Check out www.evseupgrade.com - Lots of us have done business with them over the years

I have 5 different EVSE's, but I still use my upgraded Panasonic every single day

Don

 

[TobyGadd]

Hi Don,

That's an interesting idea. Alas, their website is down--and it's not clear when they'll be back up again.

Cheers,
Toby

 

[TobyGadd]

I've been looking at Clipper Creek's website, and I'm intrigued by the new HCS-D40P Plug-in Dual Charger: https://store.clippercreek.com/new/dual-ev-charging-station-nema-6-50-plug

I'm not impressed by the price, since it's more expensive than two chargers that do pretty much the same thing. But it's nice that it only uses one NEMA 6-50 plug.

I'm thinking of adding a NEMA 6-50 outlet near the breaker panel at the back of the garage--which we could plug into directly most of the time. We sometimes leave our cars outside of the garage, so a 40-amp extension cord would let us position the charger where it's most convenient. Seem reasonable?

 

[JoeS]

If you're going to be installing new wiring, I would add a NEMA 14-50 socket on the inside right of the garage, right by the entrance. That location allows for a very short charging cable to the car and also allows for easily charging a car outside the garage door. Just use a plastic hose hanger for the cable. The Neutral wire (in addition to the Ground) will have a negligible increase on installation cost. NEMA 14-50 seems to be becoming the de-facto standard for EV charging and is used in RV campgrounds with 50A service.

I would then simply find the cheapest portable 240vac EVSE you can find, but I would be tempted to future-proof it by getting one that handles 32A and has a NEMA 14-50 plug on it, recognizing that our i-MiEV only draws about 14A at 240vac. You already charge your i-MiEV at 8A using a 120v 15A outlet, so why not continue doing that and simply have a single 240vac EVSE and share it between cars when needed?

Prices keep dropping and I see that 16A 240vac EVSEs are now down to about $150.
Here's a 32A 240vac EVSE for $235 on eBay with 14-50 plug -
https://www.ebay.com/itm/EV-Chargin...ger-EVSE-J1772-NEMA14-50-Display/383368051084, although I personally prefer portable EVSEs to be dual-voltage and have adjustable current for versatility on the road.

 

[jray3]

Sounds reasonable, though you might be able to install the 14-50 outlet near the garage door and on the passenger side such that the EVSE's original cord will reach the charging inlet when the car is parked inside or outside without any extension cord. I did this, simply running the J1772 cord beneath the garage door for the last 8 years, keeping the EVSE dry while usually charging outdoors.

 

[Don]

A single 14-50 socket near the garage door makes the most sense, if you're going to go to the trouble to have an electrician install anything. With a proper home made wye pigtail, you could easily plug two EVSE's, either L1 or L2 or one of each into that single socket. Maximum versatility, minimum cost and you wouldn't need to spend a dime to upgrade to a 32 amp EVSE should you one day buy an EV with a larger charger

Don

 

[TobyGadd]

Thanks so much for the feedback, ideas, etc. This forum was one the reasons that I bought my first i-Miev. Thanks to all of the great minds who so eagerly share their thoughts!

 

[wmcbrine]

A single 14-50 socket near the garage door makes the most sense, if you're going to go to the trouble to have an electrician install anything. With a proper home made wye pigtail, you could easily plug two EVSE's, either L1 or L2 or one of each into that single socket. Maximum versatility, minimum cost and you wouldn't need to spend a dime to upgrade to a 32 amp EVSE should you one day buy an EV with a larger charger

...although I hope you won't try to run two 32 A EVSEs off a single 50 A outlet at the same time. :shock:

Personally I'd be more comfortable with two outlets, each on its own circuit.

 

[Don]

...although I hope you won't try to run two 32 A EVSEs off a single 50 A outlet at the same time. :shock:

He could even do that - Just set each EVSE to draw 20 amps, or one to draw 30 and the other to draw 10 . . . . but he'll never have to worry about that charging two iMiEv's

Don

 

[TobyGadd]

Have no fear, I won't put more than 40 amps through the circuit--no matter how many cars I'm charging on it. That said, circuit breakers are there for a reason!

 

[blackheart]

Also, you can have your OEM Panasonic EVSE 'upgraded' to 12 amps and it will do 12 amps on either 120 volts L1 or on 240 volts L2. Since the car uses less than 14 amps on L2, an upgraded EVSE will charge at better than 90% of the maximum possible . . . . and, if you need to use L1, it will provide 12 amps instead of the usual 8, which is a 50% increase. Handy even if you do eventually buy some other L2 EVSE. Check out http://www.evseupgrade.com - Lots of us have done business with them over the years

I have 5 different EVSE's, but I still use my upgraded Panasonic every single day

Don

Looks like EVSEUpgrade is no longer in business. The website is down anyway.
Anyone still have their instructions on changing the charge amperage? Thanks!

 

[JoeS]

Programming the EVSEUpgrade.com modified EVSE

Looking at the face of the J1772 plug you'll see three large sockets and two small ones.

Plug in the EVSE.

Get a paperclip and bend it so that it straddles (shorts out) the two small sockets.

When you do that, the EVSE red ("Fault") light flutters rapidly.

Depress (click) the J1772 release lever - the number of times you press it is equal to the number of amps you want to program. With each click the green light on the EVSE blinks once.
For 120vac it is six to twelve
For 240vac it is six to thirteen

When you're done clicking, simply pull out the jumper paperclip.

The EVSE green light will now flash showing the number of amps you have programmed.

I keep a bent paperclip permanently attached to my J1772 handle with a piece of string.

As an aside, I personally consider this programming implementation/mod of an existing product to be absolutely brilliant!