Level 2 Charging at Home Stops

[danpatgal]

Thanks for the tip!

I've been meaning to ask my wife for updates. I know it has happened at least one time in the last week.

I'll get the serial and call them tomorrow!

 

[Applewins]

Well I've been having the exact same issue and symptoms as danpatgal with my Schneider EVSE Gen. 2. Just started yesterday and it's hard to get a full charge.
MiEv has 3,400 miles (purchased as a demo)
Charger is 1 week old
Dedicated circuit, 40 amp breaker, all done by a good licensed electrician
I've removed the batteries from the remote thinking that was the issue.

I'm about ready to call Schneider if the problem continues. Very frustrating!

 

[MLucas]

Interesting, I'd definitely call Schneider. From another posting, I've read they are very helpful. They'll probably want to know what you are experiencing. I have the Gen 1 Schneider and have no problems with it whatsoever. It works perfectly everytime since I bought it last summer.

 

[Applewins]

Well I've been having the exact same issue and symptoms as danpatgal with my Schneider EVSE Gen. 2. Just started yesterday and it's hard to get a full charge.
MiEv has 3,400 miles (purchased as a demo)
Charger is 1 week old
Dedicated circuit, 40 amp breaker, all done by a good licensed electrician
I've removed the batteries from the remote thinking that was the issue.

I'm about ready to call Schneider if the problem continues. Very frustrating!

Here's an update: I called Schneider late Friday (they were great) right before everybody was heading out for the long Christmas break but a gentleman named Rick stayed on the phone and helped me out. He said the model I have has been updated to resolve a known issue, the one I've been experiencing.
Please note the model number, EV2430WS and the "12442670018AO" as this is the unit that falls under the probable replacement category. They will be calling me after New Years to probably facilitate the replacement.

Tried to post a picture of the Schneider, no luck. Oh well. Merry Christmas to all.

I'm speculating this situation occurs after I ran the car almost out of electricity. Last night, after shutting down a few times, it finally stayed charging. I'll track it with an update for the next couple of weeks.

 

[Applewins]

Well I've been having the exact same issue and symptoms as danpatgal with my Schneider EVSE Gen. 2. Just started yesterday and it's hard to get a full charge.
MiEv has 3,400 miles (purchased as a demo)
Charger is 1 week old
Dedicated circuit, 40 amp breaker, all done by a good licensed electrician
I've removed the batteries from the remote thinking that was the issue.

I'm about ready to call Schneider if the problem continues. Very frustrating!

Here's an update: I called Schneider late Friday (they were great) right before everybody was heading out for the long Christmas break but a gentleman named Rick stayed on the phone and helped me out. He said the model I have has been updated to resolve a known issue, the one I've been experiencing.
Please note the model number, EV2430WS and the "12442670018AO" as this is the unit that falls under the probable replacement category. They will be calling me after New Years to probably facilitate the replacement.

Tried to post a picture of the Schneider, no luck. Oh well. Merry Christmas to all.

I'm speculating this situation occurs after I ran the car almost out of electricity. Last night, after shutting down a few times, it finally stayed charging. I'll track it with an update for the next couple of weeks.

Just another update after another week. I've been able to repeat the issue of the charger stopping prematurely when I run battery power down to 2 bars or less.. If I recharge with three bars or more, the Schnieder charger works as it should. It'll be interesting to see what Schneider says next week when they are supposed to call me. Replacement of unit seems like the logical solution. Stay tuned.

 

[JoeS]

Applewins, thanks for keeping us up-to-date. Perhaps surprisingly, the car draws a very constant power for its entire charging cycle, until the end when it goes into cell-balancing and the power draw curve looks like a ski-jump slope. The only interruption is the (usually) six- or ten-minute break while charging, which I've seen to be as much as 20 minutes. I had not seen any difference in power draw, even when starting below two bars (which for me is a very rare occurrence). For my L2 charging at 240vac, the car draws exactly 3.090kW even though the 240vac may fluctuate a bit. At public L2 EVSEs (using 208vac?) the power draw is less.

 

[garygid]

From the other (Volt) thread...

Apparently the model EV2430WS is the older model,
designed to work with 240v input, and trip its GFI at a sometimes
too-low 5 milliamps (ma) of noise/leakage current.

The 5 ma trip setting is typical of residential GFI circuits.
However, the J1772 standards suggest using 20 ma in EVSEs.

The newer model is EV230WS (2 instead of 24) and it tolerates 20 ma
of noise/leakage current before it "trips". This makes the newer model
more tolerant to "noise" on the AC power lines that would trip the
earlier model. The charger in the car can generate a lot of "noise".
Apparently this model also is designed for both 240v and 208v operation.

 

[Applewins]

From the other (Volt) thread...

Apparently the model EV2430WS is the older model,
designed to work with 240v input, and trip its GFI at a sometimes
too-low 5 milliamps (ma) of noise/leakage current.

The 5 ma trip setting is typical of residential GFI circuits.
However, the J1772 standards suggest using 20 ma in EVSEs.

The newer model is EV230WS (2 instead of 24) and it tolerates 20 ma
of noise/leakage current before it "trips". This makes the newer model
more tolerant to "noise" on the AC power lines that would trip the
earlier model. The charger in the car can generate a lot of "noise".
Apparently this model also is designed for both 240v and 208v operation.

Thank you for that info. It will help when I speak to Schneider next week.
Happy New Year!

 

[danpatgal]

I've spoken with Rick at Schneider as well, a few times, just before Christmas. They agreed finally (after I reset the breaker, asking all sorts of questions about it charging on the standard EVSE (yes), making sure the car was needing a charge (duh, yes)) that the unit was defective and that I should return it through the retailer (Lowes, in my case). I called my local Lowes (though I bought it online and had it shipped to me directly) and they said they'd take the return and give me a full refund. After that I'm not sure I'll get the Schneider again ... but I've actually not gone through the trouble yet to return it, so we'll see.

I mentioned the information on the ground fault limit (5ma vs. 20ma) in the Volt thread and though initially Rick dismissed it, ultimately he seemed to feel it was the problem. He said something like, "Our standard for ground fault protection in our products has been 5ma, but the other EVSEs have gone with 20ma ... so that's why we've updated our EVSE". Rick admitted he was not an engineer (just the customer service technician), but it seems reasonable to me based on the behavior of the unit. Perhaps the "leakage" could vary (depending on humidity, moisture, temperature, and SOC) so that's why the charger worked sometimes while others it stopped. It sure would have been nice to have some error code on the EVSE indicating a GF, if that's what was happening each time.

I'll give an update once/if I get the refund from Lowes and which EVSE I'll get to replace it. I'm not sure I'll get a Schneider again based on the issues I've had so far.

 

[JoeS]

Hi danpatgal, thanks for updating us on your problem and the Schneider discussions. Yes, pity there's no feedback to the user telling us that the ground fault current is the issue. Interesting that your problem was intermittent.

I purchased a SPX Power Xpress EVSE before I even had my iMiEV and before EVSEUpgrade was doing Mitsu's L1 EVSE. I chose the SPX because it operates on both 120vac and 240vac, has a number of different current settings, and is relatively portable compared to most other L2 EVSE's. As a straight charging station, it works fine, and its wall mounting bracket allows one to remove it quickly. The SPX does have compatibility issues with the Mitsubishi Remote, both when using the timer(s) and pre-heating/cooling. It's a hit-or-miss proposition, and I never know if the programming will 'take' … sometimes it works perfectly with the first button-push, sometimes it 'takes' when you hit the send button again, and yet at other times it refuses repeatedly, unlike the Mitsu L1 EVSE which works perfectly with the Remote every time. I'm hoping that Mitsubishi's upcoming upgrade will fix these issues.

Another reason I bought the L2 EVSE is that I wanted a second EVSE for redundancy and I originally thought I would be using L2 far more than I am in actual practice.

If I had to do it over again, I would simply go with the EVSEUpgrade and maybe experiment with the Open EVSE if I had the time. Since I talked my neighbor into a Leaf (he needs five seats), I have a backup EVSE now anyway. :lol:

I wouldn't dismiss the Schneider EVSE as it seems that their customer service is responsive and sounds as though they're aware of the marginal ground-fault current situation and have taken care of it. Besides, they're nice enough to sponsor an ad on this forum. :roll:

 

[Applewins]

From the other (Volt) thread...

Apparently the model EV2430WS is the older model,
designed to work with 240v input, and trip its GFI at a sometimes
too-low 5 milliamps (ma) of noise/leakage current.

The 5 ma trip setting is typical of residential GFI circuits.
However, the J1772 standards suggest using 20 ma in EVSEs.

The newer model is EV230WS (2 instead of 24) and it tolerates 20 ma
of noise/leakage current before it "trips". This makes the newer model
more tolerant to "noise" on the AC power lines that would trip the
earlier model. The charger in the car can generate a lot of "noise".
Apparently this model also is designed for both 240v and 208v operation.

Thank you for that info. It will help when I speak to Schneider next week.
Happy New Year!

Scheider support called me as promised. As it turns out, the model number doesn't necessarily denote 'new' or 'older' model. It's really determined by the serial number and according to the Tech, who was very helpful, I do have a model with the newer firmware.
To re-cap, I've had the disconnect happen three times and only when the car is in a deep state of discharge. They asked me to monitor the situation and we will be staying in touch via email. So far they seem very supportive and I'm willing to work with them to see if the issue can be resolved.

 

[Applewins]

I thought I'd update this post one last time. Schneider was very helpful in trying to resolve the issue of the charger stopping for no apparent reason, only to find the car not charged and ready to go in the morning. They asked me to verify with the Mitsubishi dealership to confirm that the charging system was working properly. Reasonable request, so I had that done and it was certified by dealership and all was well. Contacted Schneider again and they said we'll send you a new unit. Please swap it out, send the other one back and let us know what you find out. I received the new one within a week, installed it and the charging has been fine ever since. One nice thing about the replaced unit is that the 18FT cable is much more flexible in the cold weather then the original. Much easier to work with and not so ungainly to use.

So, after an initial stumble, the Schneider charger is working well. I still recommend the charger and many kudos' to the service support team there.

 

[Vike]

Glad to hear a happy ending to this tale. It's good to know that the reasonably priced Schneider will get the job done, and that issues with defective units are (eventually) resolved.

 

[danpatgal]

... issues with defective units are (eventually) resolved.

While we posting about it ... I took my Schneider 1st Gen EVLink back to Lowes (though I had it shipped to me) without a problem. This was the recommendation from Schneider after several unsuccessful attempts to get the unit to work correctly. I'm actually working with a local EV guy to get a new EVSE, it may eventually be the Schneider (Gen 2). I'd not hesitate to do it either, Schneider was easy to reach and reasonable to work with.

 

[Applewins]

I thought I'd update this post one last time. Schneider was very helpful in trying to resolve the issue of the charger stopping for no apparent reason, only to find the car not charged and ready to go in the morning. They asked me to verify with the Mitsubishi dealership to confirm that the charging system was working properly. Reasonable request, so I had that done and it was certified by dealership and all was well. Contacted Schneider again and they said we'll send you a new unit. Please swap it out, send the other one back and let us know what you find out. I received the new one within a week, installed it and the charging has been fine ever since. One nice thing about the replaced unit is that the 18FT cable is much more flexible in the cold weather then the original. Much easier to work with and not so ungainly to use.

So, after an initial stumble, the Schneider charger is working well. I still recommend the charger and many kudos' to the service support team there.

Well, I spoke to soon. For the last two days the charger continues to stop working at radom times. Getting tired of waking up in the middle of the night just so see if its charging. I think i'll call Home Depot and see if I can return it.

 

[Applewins]

Another update.....
Home Depot said no problem returning the Schneider charger for full credit. So I ordered a Siemans Versacharge 30AMP bottom feed from Home Depot and it's supposed to arrive Tuesday. Reports are good on this unit so I'm sure it'll work. The Schneider stopped charging twice last night........what a pain.

 

[fjpod]

Darn, I was just planning to get the 1st Gen Schneider EV link at HD because the price is down to $699, and it gets a high consumer rating.

I would ask the OP...are you sure you have a good ground? Because I was having intermittancy problems with my OEM level one until I added a new ground wire to my garage. The power in my garage was through a switch from the house, so there was really no third wire to ground the outlet, except a metallic ground. My garage was originally wired over 50 years ago when there were no three wire grounded outlets. The charger would work for a while, then stop. After I added the ground wire, it worked flawlessly.

Since then, I have rewired my garage for 30 amp 220V, but I am still only using the OEM Level 1. All is well, and I may just try that Schneider anyway.

 

[aarond12]

The version 1 charger doesn't list compatibility with the i-MiEV in its description, but the version 2 (more expensive, of course) does. Unless you enjoy returning products, I might not let the low price of the version 1 tempt you.

Did anyone else see the Leviton unit with the 240V plug? I think it is $799. Nice because it plugs into existing wiring.

 

[Applewins]

Darn, I was just planning to get the 1st Gen Schneider EV link at HD because the price is down to $699, and it gets a high consumer rating.

I would ask the OP...are you sure you have a good ground? Because I was having intermittancy problems with my OEM level one until I added a new ground wire to my garage. The power in my garage was through a switch from the house, so there was really no third wire to ground the outlet, except a metallic ground. My garage was originally wired over 50 years ago when there were no three wire grounded outlets. The charger would work for a while, then stop. After I added the ground wire, it worked flawlessly.

Since then, I have rewired my garage for 30 amp 220V, but I am still only using the OEM Level 1. All is well, and I may just try that Schneider anyway.

Yes, I am very confident that ground is good. It was installed by a professional electrician and thoroughly inspected by local Inspector. I have Square D panel and breakers and the house is about 20 years old.

 

[Applewins]

The version 1 charger doesn't list compatibility with the i-MiEV in its description, but the version 2 (more expensive, of course) does. Unless you enjoy returning products, I might not let the low price of the version 1 tempt you.

Did anyone else see the Leviton unit with the 240V plug? I think it is $799. Nice because it plugs into existing wiring.

I currently have the version 2 Schneider that I purchased from Home Depot, and this is the second one. Schneider replaced the first one. The Siemans Versacharge NEMA-4 comes with both hard wire version or with a pig tail. Yes, a little pricier at $849.oo, from HD, but really don't care at this point. I'm just looking for something that works, and these units overall get very good reviews. I'll repost again later this week with results. This unit also has the capability of a higher charge rate for my next electric car when this lease is up.