Level 2 charger stops before full charge

[Lithim]

Greetings electronauts,
I'm writing this for my sister-in law in San Antonio who has a 2012 ES without ChadeMO.
Bosch charger (level 2), model EL-51253 stops charging 4 bars from fully charged. This has happened the last three of four times car needed charging. When the level 1 (OEM) charger was plugged in after the level 2 stops, the level one indicates a full charge. (Green light on EVSE).
Tried using (turning on) the remote control. It seemed to restart the level 2 charger based on lights on the charger face. However, no additional power flowed to the car. It's as if the on board charger/electronics thinks the car is fully charged.
I seem to remember one of our member's having a similar problem but I could't find any information doing a search on the forum.
Any help would be appreciated. All hands on deck.
2012 ES, silver with CHAdeMO
Lease expiring next month!!!!!

 

[PV1]

Hate to break it to you, but the battery may have a bad cell. Do you have access to CaniOn?

 

[Lithim]

Have been following caniON descriptions on the forum but have not used it myself. What would you suggest for a new user to get started to check the battery?
Thanks

 

[PV1]

A decent Android Tablet or phone (Samsung's Galaxy series, Motorola Droid, etc.) and an OBDLink MX from Scantool. I currently use the MX with a Droid Turbo and it runs quite well. Really the only thing you need to watch are the cell voltages, so displays such as Map, Cockpit, Accelerator Pedal history, and GPS can be turned off in CaniOn. This helps to ensure stable operation.

The cell voltages should all be just about the same, especially at higher charge levels. This is the screen you want to watch while the car charges.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/cqchs6rpkzxquz0/Screenshot_2015-01-06-20-23-45.png?dl=0

Here's the link to the OBDLink:
http://www.scantool.net/obdlink-mx.html

 

[JoeS]

Lithim, I would simply have your sister-in-law take the i-MiEV to the dealer and explain the symptoms exactly. The car's battery system is under warranty. Oh, and let us know what happens.

 

[Malm]

Hate to break it to you, but the battery may have a bad cell. Do you have access to CaniOn?

I would believe more in a bad cell if the car charge less bars in the more recente charges. Normally, when a bad cell becames a reallity, car is going to charge less and less bars every charge. Things deteriorate fast when we have a bad cell. I think this I-MiEV isn't doing that. Maybe just a bad callibration. The car thinks that each bar means much more energy that in the reallity each bar means, and 12 bars in that case can mean a full charge.

My car somewhere in the past, sometimes, only charged 15 bars.

 

[PV1]

That's why I made the suggestion to check it with CaniOn instead of simply going to the dealer (or before going to the dealer). Checking the battery with CaniOn when the i-MiEV throws us curveballs like this can help us better understand the car's functionality more.

I can understand a car that hasn't been driven much for a while or a new one not going to 16 bars for a full charge because of a misbalanced battery, but the i-MiEV in question just started doing this from what I gather. With CaniOn watching the car, we can understand why the behavior change occurred.

 

[Lithim]

Thanks for all the feedback on the latest gremlin.
The Bosch level 2 was a recent addition. Less than one month old. It worked fine until just this week. Prior to its purchase all charging was done with OEM level one and getting to full charge ( 16 bars ) has never been an issue.
Last discharge level prior to problem was down to two bars. Car is used regularly every day.
Will pass on suggestions to my S-I-L when she returns from out of town.
Thanks all.

 

[PV1]

How does the car charge on level 1? Will it go to 16 bars with the stock cord? If yes, then it may be your Bosch EVSE, not the car.

 

[RobertC]

Thanks for all the feedback on the latest gremlin.
The Bosch level 2 was a recent addition. Less than one month old. It worked fine until just this week. Prior to its purchase all charging was done with OEM level one and getting to full charge ( 16 bars ) has never been an issue.
Last discharge level prior to problem was down to two bars. Car is used regularly every day.
Will pass on suggestions to my S-I-L when she returns from out of town.
Thanks all.

How does the car charge on level 1? Will it go to 16 bars with the stock cord? If yes, then it may be your Bosch EVSE, not the car.

You could also see if the car will charge properly at a Level 2 charging station. PlugShare shows many Level 2 charging stations in San Antonio.

If it still won't charge, the problem is most likely the battery pack or on-board charger.

 

[Lithim]

Level 1 (OEM) EVSE was tried after the level 2 stopped charging early with 4 bars to go.
Level one charge light came on briefly then went off as if car had a full charge.
Charge indicator inside car I believe ??? was off.
Will suggest she try a public level 2 charger for one more data point.
Thanks for all the suggestions. I willl report back with findings.

 

[Lithim]

Here's the latest from my sister-in-law.
Electronic motor unit warning light has started to come on. Tried charging on level 1 with initial charge level about eight bars. Charger started but did not add any new bars.
Car taken into San Antonio dealer today. Proposed solution is to completely drain down the battery by leaving on lights, radio and other electronics. Does that make any sense? Do the dealers service departments run any battery or charger diagnostics?
I called Mitsu customer service however they had no access to technical help.
What diagnostics if any have other forum members had performed on their cars at the dealers' ?
Very frustrating

 

[dniemeyer99]

As a person that has gone through this and have had to have the battery pack replaced, it is most likely a bad cell.

If you are able to drive the car say to 4 bars and than be able to charge to 8 bars than it IS NOT THE on-board charger. The control of the number of amps to the battery is controlled by the ECU (electronic control unit) which control all functions to the car. The ECU is required to monitor each cell of the battery pack to make sure it does not over charge any of them. If one cell is overcharged there is a potential of shorting that cell which in rare cases is a fire hazard.

In your case, it is most likely that one cell is defective (remember there are 88 cells) and it is reaching max voltage of 4.1 v before all the others. The other cells are maybe at 3.7 v and the balancing circuit will take forever to bring the other cells to 4.1 v as it will discharge the bad cell via a small heating circuit and than charge all the cell. I am not sure if the ECU will stop balancing after five tries but it would make sense if it did.

Bring the car to the dealership and be prepared to wait a long time to have the car fixed. When I had my pack replaced (same symptoms as yours) it took 10 weeks.

Sorry for the bad news.

Dave

 

[Lithim]

dniemer99,
Thanks for your input.
A few days after the car stopped charging at approx. 12 bars it was driven down to about 8 bars or half charge. It then sat unused for four days. At that point an attempt was made to charge again with level 2 and level 1. Neither was successful. No bars of charge added.
So, does this indicate a battery (cell) problem or a charger/ECU problem? Also, the electric motor warning light has come on during the last charging tries.
Car currently at dealer.
Thanks all.

 

[JoeS]

Lithim, look at the bright side of all this: your sister-in-law may get a brand-new battery out of this! After this is over with, I'd be interested in knowing what your SIL's battery charging habits normally were.

 

[Lithim]

Here's the latest news out of San Antonio.
After answering numerous questions from the dealer service department regarding driving habits, charging habits, number of passengers in the car, and weather conditions my sister-in-law will be getting a new battery!!
Although the dealer has not done any diagnostic tests, Mitsubishi has decided to replace the battery based on their extensive data base with other I-MIEVS and the answers to my S-I-L's questions.
Personally I find the experience frustrating in that the system of determining the problem is pushed aside and the customer is kept in the dark. It's like the Mitsubishi black hole of knowledge.
Never was able to get a check on individual cell voltages.
Lithim
2012 ES, silver with QC
Lease expires in one week

 

[BillThompsonMIEV]

Curious as to which San Antonio dealer was used.

 

[Lithim]

The dealer's name is Mission Mitsubishi. Same place where car was purchased new.
Are new batteries shipped from Japan or is inventory available in the USA? Anyone know?

 

[PV1]

Shipped from Japan, using an i-MiEV as a carrier originally, but then they developed a large crate to house the battery and a lift.