Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

[Don]

As I said before, I think your experiences with the heater are going to be very similar to our experiences with the A/C down here where we need to run it on a daily basis most of the time for at least 6 months out of the year - Both the heater and the A/C draw similar amounts of current from the battery pack

85 here today, BTW

If you had to run it on MAX heat all the time, I'm sure you'd see your range decrease by 1/3rd or more, but that's seldom necessary. We only use MAX air for 3 or 4 minutes after we return to the car after leaving it sit in full sun - Otherwise, we're much as you describe . . . . the temp dial a couple clicks from the centered position and the fan 2 or 3 clicks up from off and when using it that way, we still get RR numbers in the '70's. It decreases range to be sure, but no where near what we were expecting

MAX heat is over 15,000 Btu's and that amount of heat *should* drive you out of such a small space in a hurry . . . . or at least make you turn the dial down

Don

 

[sandange]

Temps dipped down here last night on the way home, and we had a warning buzzer go of to my surprise.
I thought there was some thing wrong when I noted an Astrix just above the km/mile RR gauge.
Later read up in the manual that this warning goes off when outside temps approach freezing & icing conditions - Pretty kool.

Temps are -4 C this morning and if they stay this way it looks like soon I will be testing out the propane heater.

 

[nt2w]

Temps dipped down here last night on the way home, and we had a warning buzzer go of to my surprise.
I thought there was some thing wrong when I noted an Astrix just above the km/mile RR gauge.
Later read up in the manual that this warning goes off when outside temps approach freezing & icing conditions - Pretty kool.

Yeah, this happened to me the other night too- scared the &^$*% out of me at first! :!:

It's actually a little snowflake- isn't that cute... same thing happens on my VW at about 39F. I scrolled through the MF display (that's multifunction, not something else :lol: ) and I think the temperature was 37F.

Looked at my records and apparently this was my first morning below 0C (balmy -2.7C) since spring. It's downhill from here!

Rich

 

[MLucas]

Sandange and nt2w - I'll be watching your post closely. I have not gotten the freezing warning buzzer yet, I'm hoping that will hold off for a few more weeks. We usually don't start getting really cold weather like that until November. Usually, Halloween is relatively mild for the kids.

 

[sandange]

Coleman Heater

I had a chance to test the Coleman catalytic tent heater while on my weekly (150 km round trip) trek to visit family yesterday morning. Temperature were -4 C (25 F) to -6 C (21 F).
The heater takes several minutes to reach operating temperature. While it's warming up, it does give off a fair bit of humidity, and there is a slight noticeable odour.

The heater was set up as in the photos shown previously in this tread, installed with one of the rear seat in the down position. One rear window was open about 1" for ventilation and I occasionally opened the drivers window an inch to help control window fogging.
I added a 12v fan in the rear compartment aimed at the rear window to help circulate the heat.
Occasionally using the rear window defrost was also a big help to keep the rear fog free

The Coleman heater performed best when the units, build in battery operated fan, was used.
- I'll have to investigate possibly powering it from a switch controlled auxiliary power outlet.

I ran the car fan on windshield defrost setting, on medium speed, without heat, to keep the windshield clear.
Frequently bouncing between fresh air and recycling air helped to control fogging from the humidity.

Once warmed up it gives off a respectable amount of heat, more so when the heater units fan was engaged - but nothing to make you break out into a sweat.
I was comfortable enough not to need the car heater.

Conclusion to date
Pros: Heat is adequate for the milder winter temperatures tested so far.
Car heater need not be used & power saved for moderate range extending on those planned longer trips.
Small investment to install.

Cons: Unit takes up trunk space.
You loose one passenger seat.
Humidity is an issue and frequent window opening adjustment are needed to regulate window fogging

As previously stated....Disclaimer
Just want to establish that I am going ahead with this at my own risk and if anyone else decides to try this, they do so at their own risk. I will not be held responsible for their actions.

 

[sandange]

Temps took a dip here in Quebec , yesterday morning started out at -9C (15.8 F) .

The driver seat heater was appreciated and will be looking at getting a passenger seat heated cushion too .
I was on my weekly family trek ( 150km, 93 miles) and
Preheated car - dressed warmly -
did not use any heat other than preheating & drivers heated seat occasionally.
Used the rear window defogger when needed and turned on the wind shield defrost fan when needed with no heat.
The only complaint was that the knees & legs were chilled.

So for the times I need to push the range in cold temperatures
- I'm considering getting one of those truckers 12 volt electric blankets, large enough to drape over the knees and legs
and reach both the front passengers.
I could double it up if I`m solo for more heat if I needed to.


I've put the propane heater aside and will try test it out later in extreme cold weather as emergency heating & preheating, for when there is no electricity available - the slight odor it gives off can be offensive for longer periods of use.

 

[MLucas]

Interesting results. I was thinking about one of those automotive electric blankets, too. So far temps are around 2C here, only saw -1C for a few kilometers last week but nothing like that since. I do preheat as I find this really helps with the range. I'm wondering if this also warms the batteries as well. Another thing I am doing is delaying my charge until I need to use the car the next morning to warm up the batteries. I read about this somewhere as an EV Cold Weather tip but can't remember where now. I garage the car at night, and the garage is usually 10 degrees warmer than the outside air based on the thermometer reading on the instrument display.

 

[sandange]

I`ve delayed the charging so it ends about 1 hour before I need it and preheat for about 15 -20 minutes,
But have not yet garaged the car.
I think I`ll start garaging it when the temp dip into the minus teens (-13 C), Below 8 F.

 

[archie_b]

Living in Wisconsin I read with interest all that is written on improving cold weather range (and comfort). Two of my three suggestions apply to all and the last applies only to those that travel by themselves or with a single passenger.

1. Get the best winter floor mats you can find. Cold usually means snow and nothing will make it harder to keep your windows clear that a wet, soggy floor. Empty the slush out from the mat as needed to keep the mat and the floor dry.

2. Use a microfiber blanket to keep your legs and feet warm. Microfiber is light weight and is excellent on retaining warmth. Amazon has several available. You can even attach one side of the blanket to the center console and alongside the edge of the seat. This will help trap some of the heat from the heater. Make sure to keep blanket clear of the pedals.

3. If you travel alone or with a single passenger, block off the front half of the car. Why try to heat the rear 50% of the car if no one uses the space. I do this by using a quilted moving blanket (which is both a good insulator and noise deadener) to cover the back of the seats down to the floor. You can add metal gromlets as needed to help attach the blanket at various points. Next find a spring loaded curtain rod that fits across the width of the interior. Attach to this rod clear, marine grade, plastic sheeting so you can see out of the rear of the car. The plastic sheet should hang behind the rear of the seat and can be attached or just left touching the blanket. It is not necessary to have a tight seal all around (a little leakage is OK).
You have now reduced the volume requiring heating in half. The front of the car will warm up quicker and require less energy to keep it warm.

On the outside, nothing affects range more than low tire pressure. For each 10 degree drop in temperature (F) you loose 1 psi. Last checked you tires when it was 60 degrees and it is now 20 degrees? You lost 4 psi.

 

[NeilBlanchard]

Has anybody tried an electric heated vest like this?

http://gerbing.com/Products/Liners/heatedVestLiner.php

Or this?

http://www.motorcycle-superstore.co...ynergy-2-0-Heated-Vest-Liner-With-Collar.aspx

 

[jackhoe]

I have a Gerbing jacket liner (sleevs and colar heated also) that I use on my motorcycle very warm. When I tryed it out in the i-miev
it got very warm becouse their is no wind going past you. I would recomend a thermostat so as to turn it down to low.

 

[MLucas]

Has anybody tried an electric heated vest like this?

http://gerbing.com/Products/Liners/heatedVestLiner.php

Or this?

http://www.motorcycle-superstore.co...ynergy-2-0-Heated-Vest-Liner-With-Collar.aspx

I have a tourmaster liner that works great on the motorcycle but haven't tried it in the car. Nice thing about tourmaster liners is they come with the thermostat.

 

[NeilBlanchard]

Thanks - having ridden about 100K miles on a motorcycle, I am sure that you will need a lot less heat inside a car. How many watts is the Gerbing jacket?

It would be awesome to stay warm and only lose as much range as running the headlights; or is it even less than that?

 

[jackhoe]

Gerbing jackett liner is rated at 12v dc, 6.4amps, 77watts, that's on high
Surface temp 135*f @ 32*f.

 

[DonDakin]

Hi All,

I have to admit that my feet are usually my weakest link in terms of feeling cold. Even in my ICE car when it gets really cold and takes forever to warm up.

I just picked up a pair of these:

http://gerbing.com/Products/insoles.php

At a local motor cycle shop. They are great. Almost no power drain and warm, toasty and versatile. You can run them off batterys in your pocket if you like. I just wired a simple cigarette lighter plug for the iMiev.

I still run the heater but I can run it less and still feel comfortable.

Electric clothing hear I come.

Don.....

 

[sandange]

DonDakin
Keep those heated insoles handy, you might need them sooner than you think -
we're heading down to -22 C ( -7.5 F) up here in the mountains tonight.
Do share with us how you feel they perform.

The heated insoles bring up a discussion that was on a motorcycle forum -
Please don't shoot the messenger. -
But though this interesting enough to bring up.

The discussion was heated gloves compared to heated grips.
There are some doctors on this forum who pointed out that the palms are very protected with calluses and have few blood vessels going through them.
Now on the back of the hand there are few or no calluses and many blood vessels. - suggesting heated gloves with the most of the heating on the backs of the hands would be more effective

I an not a doctor - but wonder if this compares with the method of heating someones feet - heat socks - or heated soles?
I'm sure both methods work.


Personally I have no problems with keeping my upper body warm with the help of the heated seat - so Far

There are skiing accessories out there to , Battery heated gloves, socks, ski boots, and probably more
My weakness - legs and feet get cold -

I'm going to try the 12v heated car blanket and hang it over my knees and legs and see how this works

 

[BillThompsonMIEV]

Sandage: I feel for you and the cold weather, which fortunately is not a problem in San Antonio,TX. How do you cope with the blanket on the legs and working the floor pedals, particularly the brakes? Bill.

 

[JoeS]

... How do you cope with the blanket on the legs and working the floor pedals, particularly the brakes?

Living in California where snow is something you go up to the mountains to ski on, I've been fascinated reading about all the cold-weather preparations. Although where I live in the hills we do often get sub-0degC frosty mornings in winter, when going off to early-morning Jazzercise in shorts :roll: in my heaterless Corbin Sparrow EV I've been successfully wrapping my bare legs with an unelectrified fleece blanket. No problem with entanglement (just need to be careful) and it's amazing how toasty warm the legs become.
OTOH, -20degC is another world. :shock:

 

[fjpod]

I could use some clarification about the heater controls, and what may be the most economical settings for extending RR. Turning the temperature control all the way up to Hot seems to have no effect on RR, yet the fan speed drops it way down.

So what exactly does the temperature control do? In more traditional cars it usually mixes in cold outside air. If this is so in the iMiev, then the most economical setting would be all the way up on hot. (which is counter-intuitive, right?)

And the recirculate control...shouldn't we keep it on recirculate to keep the cold outside air out?

 

[sandange]

Haven't tried the blanket yet , will pick one up today or tomorrow along with a heated seat cushion for the front passenger.

The blanket idea came from a fellow EV driver I meet from Ottawa, who drives a Leaf and experienced a Canadian winter last year, - but his blanket was not heated.

My observation- dropping off my wife at the train station 50 minutes round trip - 35 km (22 miles)

With the temperature this morning 5:30 am, -18C ( 0 F ) - weather man was off, - he predicted -22 ( -7.5 F )
Had the car in heated garaged 10 C ( 50 F) overnight & preheated 10 minutes before departure in garage with defrost mode.
Floor mats were a little wet from tracking in first snow form the day before.

Left and everything was warm and toasty, with heater 4 notches into red and fan speed on medium.
Shortly after departure 4-5 minutes, with outside temperature exposure ,
wind shield started to fog and freeze along top and side edges on the inside, along with most of the front drivers and passengers side windows

Cranked up the fan to full on the dial but did not use the boost and upped the temp red scale to 3/4
waited waited 7-8 more minutes but frost on the inside of the window was not receding just staying there - a 3 inch border along sides and top of wind shield,
Opened 1 front and 1 rear window a crack and kicked in the booster on the heater - frost receded within 3 minutes and turned booster off .

Kept the heater setting with 3/4 into the red and 5/8 fan speed the rest of the trip.
Things seemed to stabilize at this point and did not need the boost again

I did need to turn on the heated seat occasionally on the way back to keep warm and started to feel the chill on the legs and feet.

I think the heater temperature control keeps the antifreeze at the temperature you selected the (red scale)
& believe the fan speed controls the rate of cooling down the antifreeze