Is there a 2013 MiEV and is it going to be discontinued?

[acensor]

...As much as we love our iMiev, we probably did incur a greater environmental impact (and spent a bit more) by having purchased it as compared to having just kept my current car and bicycled more (as I have done a lot - but less so now with the EV).

Some of my rationalization to do it now was how it might affect others. As rare and expensive as an EV might be, it's a better transition for most people used to driving a gasoline car than cycling, for example. .......And collective purchases will help fund future development and lower costs as larger scale manufacturing kicks in. I think that if despite the "range" issue, if the costs (without rebates or credits) would be on par with a similar gasoline car, many more would buy one.

Of course, it is really nice and fun to drive. That is worth something.

In MHO your rationalizations have some real merit, Dan:
If no one buys this first-generation (at least first commercially serious generation) of EV's there will be no energy for further ones or other lower footprint initiatives from the big players or the government. Similarly if no one sees them out driven by real human beings (not just folks who can afford $100K toys.)

And you can't put a price easily on "fun to drive."

So who knows, maybe I'll be back here.
If our local dealer makes us an very tempting offer on his demo car (if he holds it until the 2013's or, say, the Smart EV comes out it'll depreciate on his lot) it could be one we can't refuse.

By the way: EV's may make even more ecological sense in Oregon and Washington state than other places, as 48% of Oregon's electricity come from non-carbon producing sources, mostly hydro... some other renewables.

Alex

 

[Don]

Alex,

Truth be told, not many of us are buying these solely because it makes good economic sense - Oh, we can 'run the numbers' and convince ourselves that it doesn't cost much (if anything) more than driving an ICE econobox (for those of us who enjoy driving such things) but for most of us I suspect much of the real satisfaction comes from driving right by all the gas stations, knowing that we're no longer contributing to the oil companies which have had their way with us for so long, plus we really like the idea that none of our money is going to those countries which will turn around our dollars and use them against us

It's a very personal decision as to what makes the best sense for anyone's family and sometimes the 'numbers' will win out over everything else - I'm just pointing out that sometimes there's lots more to it than just the numbers :mrgreen:

Don

 

[acensor]

Alex,

Truth be told, not many of us are buying these solely because it makes good economic sense - Oh, we can 'run the numbers' and convince ourselves that it doesn't cost much (if anything) more than driving an ICE econobox ......
.......- I'm just pointing out that sometimes there's lots more to it than just the numbers :mrgreen:

Don

Yeah, thanks for that last reminder.

But it sure is helpful when the numbers can be made to honestly line up with, or at least not contradict, that "lot's more to it."

A;ex

 

[aarond12]

Then there are people like me. I hate gas stations (because when I need one, I'm already running late); I never remember to change my oil; and I just don't like all the consumables and replaceables in an ICE. Too much time maintaining that Rube Goldberg machine under the hood.

Bottom line: I'm a cheap bastard. I drive an EV because it's cheap and doesn't require continual and expensive maintenance. I do some things for the environment, like recycle stuff, but I don't consider myself a tree hugger or environmentalist.

 

[Vike]

If we drove 30,000 or 50,000 miles a year, or as I say, if we didn't have good cars we rather like, the answer would be different.
. . .
ANYWAY,Without doing the analytic numbers that I did, she recently came to the conclusion that it doesn't really make compelling sense for us to jump on the EV train right now. Perhaps we'll be sorry we waited if there's a gas crisis and lines at the pump or gas soars to $7 three years from now.
Or maybe we'll be glad we waited when 5 years from now the MiEV or whatever's available is only slightly higher cost and has twice the range and all the bugs worked out and chargers are all over the place.

I'm a little dissappointed as owning and driving an MiEV would be fun, but in OUR situation a bit too much of a frivolity for now.

This is an entirely rational decision, especially as you already have cars that are well-suited to your needs. Dollars and cents, today's EVs aren't a screaming deal - they're just the best deal we've seen to date.

I think many of us who are buying at this stage just enjoy the EV driving experience and/or really believe in the technology's potential and want to participate in starting the "virtuous circle" that we hope will kick-start a self-sustaining EV market. In my case (as with many I'm sure), it's a bit of both. The bottom line for me is that I've always been fascinated by EVs and promised myself for years that I'd buy one as soon as it was a viable proposition for me. The i-MiEV at ~$23k (after credits) and 60-70 mi. range checked all the boxes, and I pre-ordered early in 2012. After the $7.5k credit, it's still pricey compared to a Yaris (ugh), but not mainstream cars like an Accord or a Miata (so I'm not really spending more, just differently), and it's very cheap to operate and maintain, so it's no great extravagance, and that's good enough - I didn't buy it to save money, I bought it because I prefer driving it to the alternatives, and don't have to pay any great premium for the privilege.

As to high annual mileage being a factor favoring an EV purchase, I'm not so sure. A drawback of current EV tech is the Catch-22 of battery economics - the less you drive the car, the less you save (the point I think you were making), but the more often you charge it, the faster the batteries degrade. This isn't some theoretical nicety - you need to keep in mind that your EV's range today will not be its range in 5 years. Driving 30k mi./yr. in an EV means lots of charging cycles (a deep cycle every day, really, but probably some opportunity charging as well for safety margins), and probably utilizing more range than is sustainable as those cycles start cutting into that range.

The truth is that lots of short runs are terrible for ICEVs, never giving their hideously complex chemical burning innards time to warm up to full purr. But that workload is perfect for EVs. They are most effective in short commuting, shopping, errands, etc. - not a daily 40 mile round trip commute on the freeway. Those short hops might not add up to a lot of miles, but they represent a lot of utility, and a lot of waste when performed with an ICEV.

 

[acensor]

Above this about two weeks ago I gave a detailed rational analysis about why we were NOT going to buy an EV in the foreseeable future.


Well, despite all the analysis of reasons I gave above in this thread, we just got one.

In part just because we went back drove it again and loved it, and substantially because we got an offer we couldn't refuse. As mentioned in another post of mine here dealers were offering to pass through their $10,000 dealer incentive. Got white with blue trim SE.... can't wait till it's delivered. So much for my left brain Vulcan/Spock-StarTreck type analysis. (Although the low price does make for a sooner break even point.) About $22500 total out the door, plus $385 'cause we have to have it truck delivered from 300 miles away.

Now, much to all my neighbors annoyance, I will be praying to see seven dollars per gallon prices at the pump.
( in truth we really do pay OVER $10 per gallon in the USA , if you count the many subtlely hidden subsidies for oil we pay through the Texas. But don't get me started as I fear that would be off topic here.)

So I'll be back.

 

[MLucas]

Congratulations, acensor. You won't regret your decision. You'll love this car more and more every time you drive it. Your monthly savings will seal the deal (beyond the 10k dealer kick-in). I'm nearly a year away from my first anniversary and still have nothing negative to say about this car. I drive 60 miles a day for work in winter conditions, this car is flipping awesome.

 

[JoeS]

Back On Topic. Forget 2013 - here's another take on what's coming:

http://insideevs.com/mitsubishis-pu...umbling-in-japan-as-outlander-phev-dominates/