Mitsubishi/Citroen OBC trouble

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bigpete

Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2020
Messages
12
Hi. As many others here, my Zero (iMiev) stopped charging the other day. Used my diagnose tool and got a message: "Converter fault. Not characterised". So I unmounted the converter and opened it. Followed this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63ZWosSyq7Q

Now it is out of the car and I have tested all of the converters fuses, but they all seem ok. The only thing I can see is the two of the capacitors with a tiny crack. Can that be the cause? Does anyone know what the parts number and where I can order them?

https://photos.app.goo.gl/LCusoFXtejBUAS53A

Can anyone see anything else abnormal, just by looking here?

https://photos.app.goo.gl/z8L62sfMRwLANZtB8
 
Those are some great pictures, i was able to zoom in to inspect the usual culprits. All i could find was the 2 cracked snubber capacitors (little blue buttons). This is the common part to fail and can be repaired.

There are details from other folks that have done this in the troubleshooting thread, but it basically involves scraping out the black rubbery material from around those capacitors, then cutting them out above the board leaving as much of the lead wire sticking up as possible (crack the cover to reveal a bit more of the wire); then carefully bend the leads of the new caps without cracking the ceramic blend radius such that it can be soldered to the stub.

Take a look at the picture and discussion from Simon on page 45 and 44:
http://myimiev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=4079&start=440

He found a good source for these and provides a link to order them.

If you have a voltmeter with a diode check function, then you can remove the faston tabs and check for a short in the high power semiconductors underneath the board, there is a schematic for this on the same page link above.

Good Luck to you and stay safe.
 
Thanks kiev for your quick reply and for taking your time to study my pictures. I will follow your advice about replacing the two capaitors and take a look at tread you are referring to :)
 
kiev said:
Those are some great pictures, i was able to zoom in to inspect the usual culprits. All i could find was the 2 cracked snubber capacitors (little blue buttons). This is the common part to fail and can be repaired.

There are details from other folks that have done this in the troubleshooting thread, but it basically involves scraping out the black rubbery material from around those capacitors, then cutting them out above the board leaving as much of the lead wire sticking up as possible (crack the cover to reveal a bit more of the wire); then carefully bend the leads of the new caps without cracking the ceramic blend radius such that it can be soldered to the stub.

Take a look at the picture and discussion from Simon on page 45 and 44:
http://myimiev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=4079&start=440

He found a good source for these and provides a link to order them.

If you have a voltmeter with a diode check function, then you can remove the faston tabs and check for a short in the high power semiconductors underneath the board, there is a schematic for this on the same page link above.

Good Luck to you and stay safe.

Hi again, kiev. Just want you to know that I read the tread you referred to, so now I have ordered the capacitors that had a crack. I will remove the paste around the existing capacitors today so that everything is ready for replacing when i get the new ones from RS Components. Thanks again, you are most helpful.
 
Hi again.

Now I opened the inverter. I used the multimeter to test the main fuse and got no contact between the poles. Is the fuse blown? Can this fuse cause the problem that the car won´t charge?

Does anyone know where to buy it and which partnumber it is?

Here is the pictures of the opened inverter and fuse https://photos.app.goo.gl/Unc5zkoPGeiUaPpa8
 
Yes that is the MCU fuse that is blown when the blue snubber caps are found cracked or exploded. It should read a direct short when measuring across a good fuse, and it will be infinite resistance when blown. They can be purchased thru a dealer parts department, or an equivalent can be ordered from online electrical parts vendors such as Mouser, digikey, RS Electronics, etc.

Go take a look at the first 2 posts on page 1 of the Troubleshooting thread for links and details about the fuse and many other aspects of the OBC. Or do a search on this website for "MCU fuse" to find discusssion and details.

Where are you located?
 
Thanks again, kiev. I am located in Norway. Many electric cars here due to the goverment´s green line and low taxes on electric cars.
 
kiev said:
Yes that is the MCU fuse that is blown when the blue snubber caps are found cracked or exploded. It should read a direct short when measuring across a good fuse, and it will be infinite resistance when blown. They can be purchased thru a dealer parts department, or an equivalent can be ordered from online electrical parts vendors such as Mouser, digikey, RS Electronics, etc.

Go take a look at the first 2 posts on page 1 of the Troubleshooting thread for links and details about the fuse and many other aspects of the OBC. Or do a search on this website for "MCU fuse" to find discusssion and details.

Where are you located?


Hi again Kiev.
Now I have replaced the MCU Fuse and soldered on a replacement for the snubber cap that was cracked. Result: The yellow fault symbol in the dashboard is gone, but i still have a fault code 0006 on my diagnose tool and the charger does the same as before; when i put in the charger pistol into the car, the fan just goes on for two seconds and stop. No charging symbol in the dash either? Link to the movie before I knew the result. PS! The new orange capacitor/snubber cap is much bigger than the old blue one. Maybe its not the right type? Where do I go from here?

https://photos.app.goo.gl/ftcmNLATBziVS9BD7
 
i'm sorry if it wasn't clear, but both snubber capacitors should be changed, even if only one appears bad. They are a pair in parallel in the circuit, if one blew then the other is likely bad also (short circuit) even if it didn't crack. At the very least it should be measured and checked to verify it's good, but the risk is not worth the cost savings of only replacing one.

In addition, before doing the capacitor change it would be worthwhile to check all the diode drops of the semiconductors in the black "waffle plate" soldered under the board. If something is shorted in the plate, then it can't be repaired and no need to replace the snubbers.
 
kiev said:
i'm sorry if it wasn't clear, but both snubber capacitors should be changed, even if only one appears bad. They are a pair in parallel in the circuit, if one blew then the other is likely bad also (short circuit) even if it didn't crack. At the very least it should be measured and checked to verify it's good, but the risk is not worth the cost savings of only replacing one.

In addition, before doing the capacitor change it would be worthwhile to check all the diode drops of the semiconductors in the black "waffle plate" soldered under the board. If something is shorted in the plate, then it can't be repaired and no need to replace the snubbers.

Hi Kiev and thanks for your quick reply. Well, you did say I should replace them both, but since i just saw that one of them was cracked, i was lazy and just replaced that one. I think I can do the replacement while the OBC is in the car, so I will try that tomorrow. If it still does not work, can it be a relay, you think?
 
If the semiconductors in the waffle plate are okay, then replacing the snubber capacitors and the fuse in the MCU will usually get it working again.

If you can carefully remove the blue cap and test it to verify that it is bad, would be very useful for you to know. Maybe just heat the solder joint from the top and ease the part up, working a little on one leg and then the other, back and forth to ease the part up and out.

Even if some solder dripped down it couldn't hurt the extra hard epoxy coating of the waffle plate. Then you can just put a new one in and solder from the top. Careful not to crack the capacitor epoxy.
 
Hi again, Kiev. This was a tough one... Put it all together, but still it doesn´t work. Just 1 second of sound from the fan when I put in the charger pistol in, after that no sound and no charger symbol. But strange enough, the yellow and the red warning light in the dash is gone. When I do the diagnostics it says charger fault. The fault code is: "vmd_dtc 00008 rex". I haven´t got a clue of what that is?

Today I managed to find a used OBC, but when I got it home I saw it was a different kind. It had no small "box" with wires on the top of the OBC and the wires was also a bit different. Also the coolant box was mounted so that it didn´t match the holes in the new one. My 2010/11 model has obviously a different kind than this OBC from 2014.

So, I am almost giving up here. Is there anything else I should try, you think?
 
[edit: Is it wired back up correctly--all the faston tabs back into the correct location? it is easy to get them on the wrong position.]

Were you able to check and verify that the semiconductors in the waffle plate were okay? i was waiting to hear back. If those are failed then the plate is bad and will need to be replaced.

Were you able to measure/check if the capacitor(s) were bad? Only replacing one may have blown thru the new one, so you should replace both of the little capacitors whenever you do one, just do them both with known-to-be-good. It is a small expense for the risk of failure.

Did you open the new 2014 box to see if it looks similar inside? There is versions without the little top box and the insides are nearly the same as before.

i'll go back and review your pictures.

Try to read out the EV-ECU DTCs, that is the main controller and should have top level DTCs.
 
bigpete said:
Hi again Kiev.
Now I have replaced the MCU Fuse and soldered on a replacement for the snubber cap that was cracked. Result: The yellow fault symbol in the dashboard is gone, but i still have a fault code 0006 on my diagnose tool

i don't know where or how you are reading these codes, but OBC code 6 is an indication of "AC input voltage abnormal".

Has there been any accident or repairs that might have disturbed the cable from the chargge port to the OBC?Seems like it is not getting any AC voltage..?

Is cable connected properly? Do you have continuity thru the cable into the OBC (thru the little box on top?) there are fuses inside the little box also.
 
kiev said:
[edit: Is it wired back up correctly--all the faston tabs back into the correct location? it is easy to get them on the wrong position.]

Were you able to check and verify that the semiconductors in the waffle plate were okay? i was waiting to hear back. If those are failed then the plate is bad and will need to be replaced.

Were you able to measure/check if the capacitor(s) were bad? Only replacing one may have blown thru the new one, so you should replace both of the little capacitors whenever you do one, just do them both with known-to-be-good. It is a small expense for the risk of failure.

Did you open the new 2014 box to see if it looks similar inside? There is versions without the little top box and the insides are nearly the same as before.

i'll go back and review your pictures.

Try to read out the EV-ECU DTCs, that is the main controller and should have top level DTCs.
I´m not capable of checking the semiconductors, Don´t know how to do that. Also didn´t manage to measure the old capasitors because they were ruined when i dismounted them. About the 2014 box, I need the coolant bottle and one of the wires that was mounted on this one. Have contacted the seller and see if he still got these parts.
 
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