Buying a Used i-MiEV

micmel2 said:

The finance company wants a little over $22K for my MiEV with over 20K miles. I know...incredible.

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I checked on the NADA and Kelly Blue Book websites and a 2012 MiEV is worth less than $11K retail value. Your finance company will be lucky to get $7K for your car at a dealer auction.

After a little research I found out that most leasing companies purchase residual value insurance. The insurance covers the leasing company's loss if a leased vehicle sells for less than its residual value. I suspect that because your leasing company has residual value insurance on your car they are unwilling to negotiate.

The funny thing about the MiEV, and most other electric vehicles, is that as soon as you drive it off the lot it is worth $7,500 less due to the federal tax credit. Additionally, the MiEV (and the Nissan Leaf) dropped their prices dramatically on newer year models, making the value of used vehicles even less.

The super low lease prices that you and others were fortunate enough to get were a great deal.

micmel2 said:

The finance company wants a little over $22K for my MiEV with over 20K miles. I know...incredible.

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They are business idiots ....they'll be lucky to even get 10K at suction... And have poisoned the well a bit for the auto leasing business. IMO.

But then, who would EVER have expected any financial institution to make bad, let alone unethical, business decisions? :?

micmel2 said:

Thank you all for your replies; it is most informative.

I have two more months on my 24 month lease, so I'm anxiously looking for an alternative. This car has been absolutely trouble-free the time I've had it. I would love to be able to buy this car, but the buy-out price is around $23K! I don't qualifty to take full advantage of the $7500 Federal tax credit, so buying used is more attractive to me....

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At first glance looks like you got a really bad deal by leasing:

Maybe not, particularly considering you were not positioned to take advantage of the full tax credit.

Depends much what the monthly lease payment was.
Example:
If you paid, say, $1500 up front, and, say, $250 per month, it would have cost you about $10,500 to keep your car for the first three years, plus, say, $11k to replace it now with a used low milage one on the open market. To now find yourself in the same position as I, a buyer, and in the three-year point. That is, we both now would own nice three year old MiEV's worth if we had to sell them about $11k. And if mauled in an accident with $9K of damage our insurers would total us out an write an ~$11K check.
It would have cost you a total of $23K to get to that point vs probably $28K+ if you did a cash purchase ....
But unlike us cash buyers you were more protected protected against the possibility that sometime in the first three years it might turn out that this was not a car worth keeping...for example, perhaps turn out that there were serious problems Mitsubishi could not or would not address... Or dealers support completly disappears, or some significant breakthrough on newer EVs made ours serous,y obsolescent. That is you could in that scenario where the car had depreciated to $5000 or a nightmare to own walk away with a $10.5K cost for the experience... Better than where us cash buyers would've been.

In fact...one sales guy for the new Spark EV pitches buying on lease to his prospects for that last idea...some buffer against finding yourself an unhappy early adopter on the bleeding edge.

So out of curiosity.. Mind telling what your lease's basic terms were?

BTW...our local dealer in 2012-13 early moved out about 5 of the maybe 7 MiEVs he had via leases to his employees... I understand Mitsubishi made the employees leases offers they were couldn't refuse.

acensor said:

So out of curiosity.. Mind telling what your lease's basic terms were?

BTW...our local dealer in 2012-13 early moved out about 5 of the maybe 7 MiEVs he had via leases to his employees... I understand Mitsubishi made the employees leases offers they were couldn't refuse.

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There was a time when Mitsu offered zero down leases for 24 months at $100 per month - Pretty hard to turn that down!

A few people got an even better deal than that - http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1081865_mitsubishi-i-in-cheapest-electric-car-lease-yet-69-per-month

Don

I got one of those $54/month (plus tax) with $2999 down on a 24 month lease. I thought it was a pretty good deal at the time since it allowed me to get into an EV immediately. I have no regrets, and I've come to appreciate the MiEV that much more. Of all the EVs out there now, I think the MiEV is the best fit for me. I'm actively looking at acquiring an used one. Keeping my fingers crossed.

micmel2 said:

I got one of those $54/month (plus tax) with $2999 down on a 24 month lease. I thought it was a pretty good deal at the time since it allowed me to get into an EV immediately. I have no regrets, and I've come to appreciate the MiEV that much more. Of all the EVs out there now, I think the MiEV is the best fit for me. I'm actively looking at acquiring an used one. Keeping my fingers crossed.

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Your situation is exactly the kind I was referring to that in the case of EVs offering low leases defies my usual "leasing is usually a deal" stance:

For two years ownership (unless you ran up huge milage) cost you only $4,295.
With any luck at all you should be able to find a used one for ~10K (don't rule out having one trucked to you from , say, 800 Mike away for $500) .
There should be quite a few coming off leases, as I csn,t imagine anyone doing the lease buyout option at the terms the leasing companies offer.

So your cost to be owner of a 2 or 3 year old MIEV will be about $15K ...... Without having had to take the risk of being stuck with a car that might not have worked out or worry about the fact (as many do if buying) that you may not be eligible to use all the tax credit.

Many who purchased outright have incurred a much bigger cost (some about $23k) even after full tax credit.. And at best even those of us who did outright new purchases after the big $10k drop on the 2012s about April 2013 and got the full tax credit come out barely a few dollar better than you likely will.

Here's a view from a warm part of the county, Houston , Texas.
Leased my silver, 2012, model ES in Feb., 2013. Only two months to go.
I have also contacted Ally with, first a request to extend the lease and second to buy the car for a reasonable price at the end of the lease. A solid,'not interested" on both counts.
My buy out residual value is an unappealing $23,006.25. Slightly more than the MSRP on a 2014!!!!!
After almost two years of charging at level 1 my RR meter as been consistent around 75 miles. Although outfitted with a level three port, the car has only been DC charged twice early in my ownership.
I have been looking online at various sites around the country for a replacement. With the large number of cars that will be coming off lease in the next few months (I remember reading that Feb 2013 was a high water mark
for sales/leases) I am anticipating prices to drop significantly.
I would positively buy my car at the end of the lease if I could track it thru the auction maze.
The comment about "gap" insurance between auction and residual price was an interesting thought.
Best regards to fellow I-Miev owners/lessees

Lithim, thank you for your reassuring reply because I just bought an used MiEV through eBay from a dealer near Dallas. My main concern is the battery capacity from a hot environment, but comments from Bill Thompson and yourself have put my mind at ease. I just paid for it today, and it will be shipped to me soon. I'm taking a chance by buying a car sight unseen, but according to the CarFax, it still has a little over a year left on the original warranty.

I just want to thank everyone who contributed their thoughts in this buying process; I couldn't (wouldn't) have done it without your collective help. Much thanks!

Dave

micmel2 said:

?....I just bought an used MiEV through eBay from a dealer near Dallas.....

I just want to thank everyone who contributed their thoughts in this buying process; I couldn't (wouldn't) have done it without your collective help. Much thanks!

Dave

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Just curious: what did it cost you, and how much is shipping from Texas to where?

$8500, and $700 shipping to the SF Bay Area. I have my fingers crossed that everything will be all right with the car.

micmel2 said:

...I just bought an used MiEV through eBay from a dealer near Dallas. My main concern is the battery capacity from a hot environment…it will be shipped to me soon...it still has a little over a year left on the original warranty.

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Congratulations. I think that you got a great deal. Looking at the glass half full, you still have over three years left on the powertrain warranty, and over six years up to 100,000 miles left on the battery warranty. Is the MiEV that you bought a silver SE model with the Quick Charge port? I had a MiEV shipped from Pennsylvania to New Jersey and it was no problem.

Micmel2, since I nearly bought that one, can you put my mind at ease and let me know if it has the quick charge port on it? I never got an answer from the seller, so I didn't bid.

RobertC, it was a white ES.

Thanks.

micmel2 said:

$8500, and $700 shipping to the SF Bay Area. I have my fingers crossed that everything will be all right with the car.

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Hard to see how you can go too wrong .
It is under warenty .

Let us know.

One now useless Afterr thought.
You maybe could have asked or paid someone in the Dallas area to go ever and inspect it fir show stoppers.

Also... Was that the price you got it on a competitive _bid_ aution ?

The bad news for the rest of us...which we a,ready knee...is our MiEVs have badly depreciated .
Many of us sort of don't care because we didn't and still don't intend to sell them ever. But eleven for those owners, and I'm one, it's a bit of a shadow: it means if we get into a serious fender bender , or one that damages our currently ~$14,000* battery, our insurer likely would just write us a $10,000 check and telling the car away.

* out of curiosity a bell year ago I asked my dealer's parts department to get me a price on a replacement battery pack and if I remember right after much delay that's what they came up with.

micmel2, congratulations! Now, maybe we should start a used i-MiEV owners subgroup :?
Sending this from Nevada City CA touristing today after an 11-hour marathon drive in my new used i-MiEV to the Sierra foothills on Christmas Day. Love DCQC!

PV1 said:

RobertC, it was a white ES.

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It looks like the same dealer, Chase Autoplex, has a silver SE with Quick Charge port. Asking $9,500.00

http://www.chaseautoplex.net

Click 'Inventory'.

PV1 said:

Micmel2, since I nearly bought that one, can you put my mind at ease and let me know if it has the quick charge port on it?

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Former owner member gmarcucio's black SE with Quick Charge port has made its way from Upstate New York to Maryland and is listed for $12,557. It has 9,752 miles. He traded it in for a Chevy Spark EV this spring. He received $9,700 when he traded it in. It is very distinctive with decals.

http://myimiev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1950&p=14995#p14995

Renn Kirby Mitsubishi has it listed. Perhaps they would be willing to negotiate.

http://www.rennkirbymitsubishi.com

RobertC, no, this model does not have the QC port. It is the base ES model without any options.

Acensor, yes, it was a competitive bid auction.

JoeS: impressive that you can take your new MiEV on a 11-hour marathon drive up to the Sierras. Certainly can't be done without the DCQC.

Anxiously waiting for my new used MiEV.

Ok. To summarize, what all should one look for when buying used? I picked up:

MiEV Remote
EVSE
Battery check with CaniOn
Tire tread and wear
Mechanical and body damage
Test functionality of electronics and HVAC.

I'm going on a short trip tomorrow to look at a used ES. From the pictures, I can tell it has quick charge (amazing how many sellers miss the QC handle location when taking pictures, this one happened to have it), it looks to be in good shape, and the previous owner found the blue decals that were stock on the white/blue SE models and put them on.

PV1 said:

I'm going on a short trip tomorrow to look at a used ES. From the pictures, I can tell it has quick charge (amazing how many sellers miss the QC handle location when taking pictures, this one happened to have it), it looks to be in good shape, and the previous owner found the blue decals that were stock on the white/blue SE models and put them on.

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I think that the MiEV you are interested in was leased by forum member Applewins in Grand Rapids, Michigan. His last post was more than a year ago.
http://myimiev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1892&p=14415#p14415

Did he happen to post any pictures? I didn't see any mention of color in his posts, just that it was a demo car. Carfax does say originally titled as lease vehicle in Michigan. The car is now in western Ohio. Ended up not going due to freezing rain all along I-70. There's a dozen wrecks just in my town, let alone along 200 miles of highway, and to pull a trailer through that just didn't seem worth the risk. We'll try again in a couple of days.