g4qber
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Joined: Tue May 15, 2012 5:32 pm

delimit motor to 80kW

Sat Jun 28, 2014 1:46 pm

is it true that the 47kW motor in the i is really a 60kW motor or even 80kW, but limited to 47kW?

if so, how to derestrict this?
Last edited by g4qber on Sun Sep 28, 2014 4:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Don
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Re: delimit motor to 60kW

Sun Jun 29, 2014 11:15 am

It wouldn't surprise me if we found that the motor was rated for more power than it's currently delivering - How would you get the full 60Kw from it? Probably by replacing the motor drive system (the inverter) with one which could output 60Kw

Don
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JoeS
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Re: delimit motor to 60kW

Sun Jun 29, 2014 12:21 pm

Don wrote:It wouldn't surprise me if we found that the motor was rated for more power than it's currently delivering - How would you get the full 60Kw from it? Probably by replacing the motor drive system (the inverter) with one which could output 60Kw
For example, http://www.sevcon.com/ac-controllers/gen-4-size-8.aspx

The hard part is integrating such a controller to operate with the existing i-MiEV systems.

I wouldn't be surprised if our existing controller is capable of a higher output ... all it probably takes is a software mod - good luck hacking that! :geek:
EVs: Two '12 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 TeslaMS85, three 156v CorbinSparrowsLi(NMC), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
Mothballed ICE: Orig.Owner '67 Saab96V4, '88 IsuzuTrooper; '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

offgridQLD
Posts: 101
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Re: delimit motor to 60kW

Thu Jul 10, 2014 5:49 pm

From memory the motor in our Imiev was taken from a large industrial forklift. It has (from memory) 35kw continuous rating. Our 16kwh battery pack limits it's input to around 16kwh/48 = 20min at full power. Electric motors have a continuous output rating (that is the input they can handle indefinitely without burning up) Though they can handle much more than this (often x2 - x3 )more as a short burst of power without heat saturation. I would say the Imiev motor could handle 80 - 100kw being fed into it for 10 seconds or so. You would be doing 160kph by then anyhow :lol: .

So to answer your question yes If you could reprogram the inverter (motor controller) to output more power or change the inverter to a more powerful one then I'm sure it could handle more burst power. 100kw would be hard on the battery's that's 6c discharge rate.

I'm happy with the power/economy balance they have chosen in the Imiev. If they gave me 80kw I would just use it all the time to get myself in trouble or shorten my range - battery life. :lol: That said a 80kw overpower button that lasted 5 seconds would be nice some times :evil:

Kurt

Don
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Re: delimit motor to 60kW

Fri Jul 11, 2014 7:44 am

Do you have any info where Mitsubishi says the iMiEV motor was originally used in a forklift? That would surprise me, since the way a car and a forklift use their motor is so very different. I would have assumed the motor in our car was specifically designed just for it

As to electric motors being capable of 2X or 3X more than their continuous ratings - That's certainly true for series or shunt wound DC motors, because the armature is powered so the amount of instantaneous power is only limited by how much current you throw at it - Double or triple the current to the field and the armature power increases proportionally, so everything stays in balance. DC motors can do some awesome 1/4 mile times at the drag strip

AC synchronous motors like the one in our iMiEV completely different animals though. The rotor is unpowered, so applying more current to the field doesn't necessarily get you much more power - Nothing like the 2X or 3X that DC motors can do. Synchronous power is limited by the strength of the rotor's rare earth magnet. You cannot apply more power to the field than the rotor can oppose, so there is a definite limit to the power available. Also, since the field and the motor housing is water cooled, the maximum power and the continuous power ratings are not far apart. Our motor is rated at 49Kw (66 HP) and it wouldn't surprise me if it couldn't do that continuously . . . . for as long as the battery holds out. They ran a stock iMiEV up Pikes Peak pretty much flat out for 15 minutes and it didn't overheat the motor
http://www.roadandtrack.com/racing/race ... 2012-37887
https://www.facebook.com/notes/mitsubis ... 3580648944

Don
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jray3
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Re: delimit motor to 60kW

Fri Jul 11, 2014 10:41 am

The i-MiEV Evo used stock motors and a stock inverter reprogrammed to 80 kW.
The i-MiEV Evo II may have not, but the MicroAutoBox programmer is available...

Here's a cross-posting from earlier Pike's Peak racer discussion.

I gleaned the following from the latest coverage on InsideEVs
http://insideevs.com/mitsubishi-motors- ... ill-climb/

Control system(Made by dSPACE)
Production i-MiEV ECU with MicroAutoBox*1

Anybody experienced with that there MicroAutoBox? Looks like a key to reprogramming our cars for more performance...
http://www.dspace.com/en/pub/home/produ ... cautob.cfm

Here's a newsletter article on it's application in the iMiEV EVOII, with a few more technical details on the car
https://www.dspace.com/shared/data/bkm/ ... -01_en/#40

The MicroAutoBox was also used in a University of Michigan EV, and they gave presentations/ wrote papers on the impementation.
https://www.dspace.com/shared/data/pdf/ ... _ebook.pdf

dSpace offers special developer kits at a discount to academia... without listing prices.
http://www.dspace.com/shared/data/pdf/2 ... 2013_E.pdf

And finally, the special price is..... $14,700 to schools, $33k to industry. Sure, I'll take two. :roll:
http://groups.csail.mit.edu/drl/wiki/im ... etails.pdf
2012 i-SE "MR BEAN" 110,300 miles
2016 KIA SOUL EV, 90 kW, 27 kWh, 34k miles
2000 Mazda Miata EV, 78 kW, 17 kWh
1983 Grumman Kurbwatt EV,170 kW, 32 kWh
1983 Mazda RX-7 EV 43 kW 10 kWh
1971 "Karmann Eclectric" EV 240 kW 19 kWh

offgridQLD
Posts: 101
Joined: Wed Jul 17, 2013 4:13 am

Re: delimit motor to 60kW

Tue Jul 15, 2014 4:30 pm

Don,
The Imiev uses a Y4F1 motor manufactured by Meidensha Corporation, Meiden.

Just do some goggling on Y4F1 meiden permanent magnet synchronous emotor. You should find its actually a generic AC motor that was used in large forklift trucks.

I stumbled across the specs a while back they gave it a one min rating a 30 min rating. Though I think the industrial continuous rating was only 25- 30kw can't remember. Yes its the same motor that they are using for 80kw in the car to .

Kurt

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