sandange
Posts: 907
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:21 am
Location: Quebec, Canada
Contact: Website

Re: Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

Fri Aug 17, 2012 5:58 am

Hi Don

After about 5 minutes of no cabin heat and only seat heat it becomes unbearable. Mind you I was not dressed in my best winter gear but I also think it's crazy to get completely dressed up is arctic survival gear to get in a $35,000 car to drive home 10Km from work.

I agree with you - Unless you have experienced these severe temperature It' hard to understand.

I have discussed winter driving with my dealer here in Blainville –

I also discussed this with a couple of other I Miev owners at the St Jerome Ecological Transportation Day.

Both have experienced some winter driving up here last winter

They also believe in pre-heating & getting supplementary heating for the cabin would extend their winter driving range

The understanding I had was that you would get about 60 % of your normal range because of all the factors involved, - Heating included

I’ve been getting around 100km – 130 km these last few weeks

So I imagine winter would be 60 –75 km approximately

I will soon find out
Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2019
Previous EVs
Puey Bluey 2014 Miev
200,000 km , 124.000 miles.
Blackie - 2012 ES Miev 2 years - 67,000 km / (41,630 miles)
http://thecordstead.blogspot.ca/

DonDakin
Posts: 376
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 7:10 pm

Re: Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

Fri Aug 17, 2012 8:49 am

Thanks for the information. I am in the process of purchasing so I should be running around my area in out Imiev in the next few weeks.

My commute to work and back is only 20KM so I think I should be fine with the imiev even in really bad weather conditions. But after reading the post with the owners manual text on the battery heater I think exposing the car to temps below -25 for long periods of time without it being plugged in may not be good for it. Keeping the car in the garage and preheating it should be fine for the trip to work but I worry that leaving the car in the parking lot at work for 8-9 hours on those bitter days may harm the battery and also chill it down to the point that even a 10 km trek home with the heat on full blast could be difficult if there is a snowstorm and lot's of traffic. It would probably be a sinking feeling sitting in traffic with the heat on watching the bars disappear... I guess that's the worst case scenario.

There are a couple of natural thing that may just work out:

In general in a snow storm the temp's are usually not that cold more on the order of 0 deg C to -10 Deg C.

When the weather does clear up and it's -25 it is often sunny and there is alot of solar heating of the interior with the car in the parking lot. Mind you the the sun does set at about 4:00 PM and the car interior cools quickly after that. (maybe a good excuse to leave work early....)

We do have another car and so I plan to use the ICE for thoses super cold days and give the imiev a break.

That being said I guess I'll also find out this winter how it goes. It would be wonderfull to post something in the spring saying that the car worked flawlessly thru the harsh Quebec winter.

Don......

sandange
Posts: 907
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:21 am
Location: Quebec, Canada
Contact: Website

Re: Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:29 am

Don

Best practice for winter driving, would be to plug in where ever possible & keep that battery warm.
So far I used the pre cooling with the remote & it works great, I think that the pre-heater & defrost are as good.

Best of luck with your purchase negotiations, and should you find yourself up near St Sauveure with your new I Mieve you can always charge up at our place.
We are the private charge station indicated on the plugshare.com web site. (Ste.-Anne-des-Lacs)
Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2019
Previous EVs
Puey Bluey 2014 Miev
200,000 km , 124.000 miles.
Blackie - 2012 ES Miev 2 years - 67,000 km / (41,630 miles)
http://thecordstead.blogspot.ca/

DonDakin
Posts: 376
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 7:10 pm

Re: Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:23 pm

Thanks Sandange,

I will look you up if I am in that area....

Don....

JrCRXHF
Posts: 63
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2012 5:37 am

Re: Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

Mon Aug 20, 2012 10:13 am

I am just going to keep the car plugged in and on days when we get more then 3" of snow i will just take the diesel truck (which also does not like the cold)

I have a 50mile round trip so in the winter when i run the heat it might be hard to make it with out plugging in at work we will see how things go.

DonDakin
Posts: 376
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 7:10 pm

Re: Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:37 pm

JrCRXHF,

Where are you located ?

Don.....

LOWRACER
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:09 pm

Re: Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

Wed Aug 29, 2012 2:42 pm

I've got insulated the heater module, that saves a lot of kWatts....
You don't need to disconnect any (dangerous high voltage-) cables or hoses!
The "Armaflex" insulation laying around the heater module like a big tube.

OK, here a few pictures:

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

DonDakin
Posts: 376
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 7:10 pm

Re: Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

Wed Aug 29, 2012 8:10 pm

Hey lowracer,

That looks like a really good Idea. Thanks for taking the time to post the pictures.

I have a couple of questions about your mod:

Do you have any information about how much it saves in energy or how much hotter the air is coming out of the vents. It looks like the temp is about 84 deg C what was it before the mod ? What was the outside temp when you did this ? Was the car moving in cold air or stopped ?

Looks like a great idea I'm sure it helps. I wonder why they didn't do this at the factory it just makes sense.

Don......

Actually I did a little poking around under the car and it looks like there are 2 liquid heating/cooling systems. I think the motor is cooled thru the rad in the front of the car just like in an ICE. The normal heater is a separate system.

I thought it might be an interesting idea if somehow the motor cooling system liquid could be switched and routed thru a second rad in the car. If this rad could be switched into the loop then you could recover some of the motor heat in the cabin. I guess it would require installing another small rad in the car and doing some plumbing and adding a some bypass valves. I have no idea if it would work well but any extra heat that could heat that cabin without the heater running would be free heat. You can always open the window to regulate the temp in the car if you had the motor heat pouring into the cabin.

Any thoughts ?

Don
Site Moderator
Posts: 2865
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 3:55 pm
Location: Biloxi MS

Re: Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

Thu Aug 30, 2012 4:15 am

DonDakin wrote:I have no idea if it would work well but any extra heat that could heat that cabin without the heater running would be free heat. You can always open the window to regulate the temp in the car if you had the motor heat pouring into the cabin.

Any thoughts ?
I would tape the remote sensor from one of the little $5 or $10 battery powered thermometers to the coolant line exiting the drive motor and take some readings before I went to all the trouble you're suggesting. You might find the coolant is 125 degrees or more on a 90 degree summer day, but only 50 or 60 degrees on a cold winter day - There might not be much heat there to recover in the winter when the temps are really cold . . . .

Insulating things as Lowracer did seems to make good sense though - It appears easy enough to do and doesn't cost much, so even if it made just a 5 or 10% difference in energy consumption, it would still be beneficial - A decent return on your dollar

Don
2012 iMiEV SE Premium, White
2012 iMiEV SE, White
2017 Chevy Volt Premier
2014 Ford Transit Connect XLT SWB wagon, 14,000 miles
1979 Honda CBX six into six

Don
Site Moderator
Posts: 2865
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 3:55 pm
Location: Biloxi MS

Re: Practical solutions for extending cold weather range

Thu Aug 30, 2012 4:27 am

Here's an article that gives some winter range data for those of you in the frozen north

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/ ... ather.html

My apologies if everyone has already read it, but I didn't see it referenced anywhere

Don
2012 iMiEV SE Premium, White
2012 iMiEV SE, White
2017 Chevy Volt Premier
2014 Ford Transit Connect XLT SWB wagon, 14,000 miles
1979 Honda CBX six into six

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