JoeS
Site Moderator
Posts: 3909
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:47 am
Location: Silicon Valley, California

Re: my Miev will not charge

Sun Jun 15, 2014 11:42 am

sandange wrote:Well I've had another set back this week. :( ...Roadside assistance towed it to the dealer Monday. Friday today & they were still running test & waiting for results. Not a happy camper. I was hoping it was something minor and quick to remedy.
Sandy, I am so dismayed by the recurrence of you original problem - tells me their original diagnosis and part replacement were questionable and/or that there is still an unfound root cause of this problem in your car. This truly needs some expert help to uncover.

Do keep meticulous notes on everything that has been done and is going on - it may be a good idea to escalate this issue to Canada Mitsubishi corporate. You have already broken ground by having the most difficult-to-solve problem anyone on this forum has faced with the i-MiEV! :shock:
EVs: 2 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 Tesla MS85, 3 156v CorbinSparrows (2 Li-ion), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab 96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
ICE: '88 Isuzu Trooper. Mothballed: '67 Saab (orig.owner), '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

sandange
Posts: 907
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:21 am
Location: Quebec, Canada
Contact: Website

Re: my Miev will not charge

Sun Jun 15, 2014 6:15 pm

Hi Don - just re read the invoice and - it reads like a short story - My French reading skills are some what challenged.
It does say they replaced the OBC & the AC unit.

This dealer is the largest for sales for the Miev in Quebec and has the equipment to handle the servicing. I don't think there is anyone close by better qualified.

Joe - Yes I will keep as many details as possible and share them as it all develops.

As you have both said - No matter how you shake it, I still have a charging problem.
Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2019
Previous EVs
Puey Bluey 2014 Miev
200,000 km , 124.000 miles.
Blackie - 2012 ES Miev 2 years - 67,000 km / (41,630 miles)
http://thecordstead.blogspot.ca/

dniemeyer99
Posts: 55
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2014 10:08 am
Location: Sudbury, Ontario Canada

Re: my Miev will not charge

Mon Jun 16, 2014 7:09 am

Your problem seems to be similar to the one I had earlier this year. My car also would not charge. My guess is that Mitsubishi will try to replace the charger. And when that does not work (assuming it is not the problem), you will get a new battery pack. The question is not if they will fix it but how long it will take. It seems that replacing the pack has a few more bureaucratic paperwork to complete within Mitsubishi. I assume this is because of the cost as well as collecting data of pack failure.

What I do not understand is in their trouble shooting, the ECU should be telling the technician an error code or the reason why the charging has failed. You are seeing the yellow exclamation mark and therefore the ECU has seen an error somewhere. A well made controls software should indicate an error code.


Dave

PV1
Site Moderator
Posts: 3066
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2012 4:22 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Re: my Miev will not charge

Mon Jun 16, 2014 7:45 am

I wouldn't think this problem is related to the battery. As we've seen on other cars, a failure of a battery cell or two is shown in the charge gauge by it not going to 16 bars. This isn't to say that there couldn't be a problem inside the pack, but it doesn't sound like a failed cell, but rather a communications issue or hardware failure of a cell or part of the CANbus, such as a bad temperature sensor.
"Bear" - 2012 Diamond White Pearl ES with QC - 2/21/2013
"Koorz" - 2012 Cool Silver Metallic ES with QC - 1/5/2015
"Photon" - 2017 Bolt EV LT in Orange with QC - 7/31/2017

Solar-powered since 10/10/2013

dniemeyer99
Posts: 55
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2014 10:08 am
Location: Sudbury, Ontario Canada

Re: my Miev will not charge

Mon Jun 16, 2014 8:35 am

As for speculating as to the charging issue and assuming there is not a internal charger problem which is always a possibility, I can see that the following would stop the charging process.

1) CANbus, this communication is done throughout the components within the car. There should be safety protocols within this communication that would shutdown the car to even be able drive the car if there were to many errors in the communication messages. Failed messages can be seen by the ECU and therefore indicate an error code. There could be a failed connection to the charger, but again an error code should be flagged.

2) Failed BMS sensor. My understanding, these sensors are on the BMS circuit board located on each of the battery cells. The board will measure the voltage and temperature on each cell and communicate to the ECU via CANbus as to the status. Clearly if the voltage on any cell is outside well define limits, charging needs to stop as there is a fire risk within the cell. Overcharging (and I mean greatly overcharging) is very bad for the cell and could short it out. Remember the Toshiba laptop fires.

3) I could also see the temperature sensor triggering the stop charging condition. We all know that high temperatures damage the cell, and if we have a failed sensor and therefore indicating a high temperature on the BMS circuit, I could see the ECU turning off the charging sequence to try to protect the battery.

4) As I said in point 2, The BMS board measure the battery voltage and tries to balance all the cells. A failing cells will have a harder time in keeping the cell balance with the rest of the pack. Which could be the reason why we do not get all 16 bars. But there will be a point at which if one cell is a 3.4 volts and all the rest are at 4.1 volts, the ECU will have to stop charging.

However, as I said before these are all guesses. What I do not understand is that there should be an error code that the technician should be able to access to indicate why the charging stopped. The previous post had indicated an A/C issue which is temperature related. So maybe there is a bad BMS board within the pack and not a bad cell.

Dave

PV1
Site Moderator
Posts: 3066
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2012 4:22 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Re: my Miev will not charge

Mon Jun 16, 2014 9:48 am

Any overcharge of a lithium battery is bad. Sadly, laptops still fry their batteries, even after the recalls. I have my laptop dialed back to 60% since it spends most of its time plugged in. At 80%, cell voltage is near 4.2 volts on the laptop.

The i-MiEV shows severe misbalance or cell failure by not going to 16 bars. We haven't seen them throw error codes on a failing battery. I would say there is a bad connection, a bad temp sensor, or another bad charger, though having 2 bad chargers in a row is unlikely.

Sandange, do you have Canion, or access to your car?
"Bear" - 2012 Diamond White Pearl ES with QC - 2/21/2013
"Koorz" - 2012 Cool Silver Metallic ES with QC - 1/5/2015
"Photon" - 2017 Bolt EV LT in Orange with QC - 7/31/2017

Solar-powered since 10/10/2013

sandange
Posts: 907
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:21 am
Location: Quebec, Canada
Contact: Website

Re: my Miev will not charge

Mon Jun 16, 2014 10:08 am

No I don't have Canion or access to the car .
Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2019
Previous EVs
Puey Bluey 2014 Miev
200,000 km , 124.000 miles.
Blackie - 2012 ES Miev 2 years - 67,000 km / (41,630 miles)
http://thecordstead.blogspot.ca/

Don
Site Moderator
Posts: 2986
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 3:55 pm
Location: Biloxi MS

Re: my Miev will not charge

Mon Jun 16, 2014 11:35 am

What's really disappointing is that they don't give you a free loaner car, nor do they seem to be in any big hurry to fix your car. I think it's safe to say that if they were footing the bill for a $50 per day rental, they would be working lots harder to get your car back to you lots sooner . . . .

Don
2012 iMiEV SE Premium, White
2012 iMiEV SE Premium, Raspberry Metallic
2012 iMiEV SE, White
2017 Chevy Volt Premier
2014 Ford Transit Connect XLT SWB wagon
2006 Itasca Navion Sprinter Motor Home

sandange
Posts: 907
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:21 am
Location: Quebec, Canada
Contact: Website

Re: my Miev will not charge

Mon Jun 16, 2014 3:42 pm

I had the same thought Don
They did offer me a rental that they would subsidize up to $20/day I would have to only pay $5 a day, plus of course the gas that can easily be $ 75 a week depending on what car I can get.

Heaven help me if I bring it back with a scratch.

Ok and I can't forget I still have to pay my car payment.

I think my wife and I will just share our ICE vehicle until it's sorted out.


We were so spoiled with the Miev as we would just hop in and drive it anywhere - always with some charging stops planned in.

Now with the ICE it's different planning but just as stressful when if you consider if you forget something or run out of time and the stores close.
Making an extra trip here & there it costs another $10 here and another $ 20 there for gas -
it quickly adds up.

So for now we often cancel extra trips. This can give me a cabin fever feeling.

Of course we can always throw more money into the tank.
Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2019
Previous EVs
Puey Bluey 2014 Miev
200,000 km , 124.000 miles.
Blackie - 2012 ES Miev 2 years - 67,000 km / (41,630 miles)
http://thecordstead.blogspot.ca/

sandange
Posts: 907
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:21 am
Location: Quebec, Canada
Contact: Website

Re: my Miev will not charge

Sun Jun 22, 2014 8:58 am

Little update

I recently visited the dealership service department and they were very apologetic.
To Make a long story short....
They are stumped.
Japan has told them what tests to run and they all show no problems.
All the battery cells test fine .
The new charger they installed tests fine.
But the same problem persists

1 1/2 month's with out our Mieve to date

I might venture a suggestion to Mitsubishi - that a mobile techie swat team be put together and sent out to do 2 things

Tackle abnormal complicated situation as this and
Give some advanced training to the dealers Miev service technicians.
Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2019
Previous EVs
Puey Bluey 2014 Miev
200,000 km , 124.000 miles.
Blackie - 2012 ES Miev 2 years - 67,000 km / (41,630 miles)
http://thecordstead.blogspot.ca/

Return to “General / Main Owners Forum”