mivanci5
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:43 am
Location: Zagreb, Croatia

New owner/member

Sat Mar 17, 2018 3:59 pm

HI all..

I have a history and reputation as an owner of weird cars and vehicles… and Miev I bought yesterday fits perfectly.

I started foo months ago new contract and to commute to work for 35km in one direction. And I was thinking, why I do not fulfil my wish for an EV, and buy myself one on excuse that I’m saving big time. (Totally sold this one to my wife) :D

Company wants to give me car 24/7 but with GPS… no way, give me the money for commute expanse, and I will buy myself a car, electric one… ;) They pay me full commute expanses, so for 5y and all electricity that I will spend, I-Miev will be fully paid off. And I do believe after 8-9 y this will still be very usable car.

So I bought nice white one, used, 9.000 euros. 2014 with 60 000km. Form local Mitsubishi dealer. It has small scratches, but who cares… Anyway, I hate when I buy a new car that has no scratches and dents, and then after some time I see the first one… I hate that feeling when I want to kill someone…

Now, little about me:

My name is Mario Ivancic, I’m from Croatia. Living in a country 35km from capitol Zagreb. Now I’m working as IT administrator in a medium IT company specialized for printing solutions.
I’m schooled car technician, and I worked in car industry for 20 years. I worked for Peugeot, Citroen, and Renault. But after big automotive meltdown in 2010-2011 her in EU. I changed my career, and started to work on my second love, computers. I like cars very much, but computer geeks are paid better… :ugeek:

And yes I met Mate Rimac (factory is 50km from my home on other side of Zagreb), we know each other from 402 drag races in his beginning with electric BMW. In that time I was driving rare Peugeot. 405T16 and Mate was pioneering and destroying transmissions with electricity :D
Do not ask me if I can get hands on Rimac parts and batteries, I did not see the guy for 10y now. And he is now very, very hard to get guy... So answer is no, I cannot. :?

This is great forum, and I hope I will contribute to it.

Sorry on my bad English, unfortunately I learned German and Russian in School. :roll:
Renault Avantime 3.0 24v
Citroen XM 2.1 dt
Citroen C2
Mitshubishi I-Miev
Yamaha XS 400 SE
Kramer 411
Store 402

JoeS
Site Moderator
Posts: 3537
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:47 am
Location: Los Altos Hills, California

Re: New owner/member

Sat Mar 17, 2018 5:28 pm

Hello Mario, and welcome to the forum! With only a 35km commute, your i-MiEV is perfect although you might need to be a little careful in the middle of winter and not drive it like your 405T16 - that car is famous for our USA Pikes Peak Hill Climb.

I attended a presentation by Mate Rimac at Stanford University - his cars are truly fantastic and I applaud his achievements!

As the i-MiEV ages, your computer hacking skills may well be needed. As you might glean from some recent forum posts, one of the stumbling blocks we have is that Mitsubishi has embedded digital interlocks which prevent simple subassembly swapping - many of the major components are encoded with the car's VIN (Vehicle Idenbtification Number) and which can only be reprogrammed by a Mitsubishi (or Citroen or Peugeot) dealer utilizing a MUT3 tool with i-MiEV software - so, if something goes wrong and even though we may know which subassembly is at fault, simply replacing it may not work. Luckily, failures are quite rare and I think you'll find the i-MiEV to be extremely reliable.

I hope that you now have the EV 'grin' and are enjoying your i-MiEV which I think you will find to be an excellent workhorse - but, be careful, your wife might decide that she really really likes driving the i-MiEV and you might be left looking for another electric car! :roll:
EVs: 2 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 Tesla MS85, 3 156v CorbinSparrows (2 Li-ion), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab 96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
ICE: '88 Isuzu Trooper. Mothballed: '67 Saab (orig.owner), '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

mivanci5
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:43 am
Location: Zagreb, Croatia

Re: New owner/member

Sat Mar 17, 2018 6:54 pm

Thank you on your welcome JoeS.

I’m familiar with VIN number coding the car computers. PSA (Peugeot-Citroen) and Renault has this system on all computer systems in car from I think 1999. But for this old models it is hacked long time ago.
I do not know I-Miev system to well, just basic layout. But I think it is similar system of coding.

What this coding basically do, is preventing computers to be interchangeable from car to car. So you need to buy new one, in a dealership, and pay for installation and coding…
Manufacture will say that is for your own safety, and it is a bit true, because your car is not so much desirable for stealing for parts.

Anyway, I will look in to it, and even now maybe it can be the way to flash eproms with “virgin” software. Problem is that main components like charger computer or electric motor control unit, are “new” and still rare in percentage of cars that Peugeot, Citroen or Mitsubishi produce. So it is less people interested to crack it. Another factor is that like you said, do not break down. So there is general lack of interest and no need to invest time in doing so.

One thing that I noticed in past one day of ownership is lack of brake light while on regen braking… NOT COOL Mitsubishi, really not cool. City driving with “B” is not an option in heavy city traffic. May be I’m exaggerating, but I do not like it.

So after brain storm of 5 minutes, and 15 min searching on forum what can be done. I did not find anything (maybe I missed something)… and idea is born… connect G force sensor on Arduino board, and connect it to brake light switch in parallel… put a little program to Arduino with: IF (g-force)= (something) THEN switch on brake lights.

Sure I need to look up in schematics of the car, and see what is most simple solution to connect to it, and to test Arduino and sensor, to see if this is simple enough.

I-Miev for sure has g sensor in airbag system, that can be used, but to hack in that data it will take more time... and when you get data, it needs digital translation to be used for activation of a switch… but it is also an option if airbag g sensor is what I think it must be.

But may be someone allrady solved the problem, or im making to much fuss over nothing?

I like this kind of stuff, but IL need a little time to get familiar with my new car.
Renault Avantime 3.0 24v
Citroen XM 2.1 dt
Citroen C2
Mitshubishi I-Miev
Yamaha XS 400 SE
Kramer 411
Store 402

Don
Site Moderator
Posts: 2733
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 3:55 pm
Location: Biloxi MS

Re: New owner/member

Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:19 am

Welcome Mario!

mivanci5 wrote:One thing that I noticed in past one day of ownership is lack of brake light while on regen braking… NOT COOL Mitsubishi, really not cool. City driving with “B” is not an option in heavy city traffic. May be I’m exaggerating, but I do not like it.

So after brain storm of 5 minutes, and 15 min searching on forum what can be done. I did not find anything (maybe I missed something)… and idea is born… connect G force sensor on Arduino board, and connect it to brake light switch in parallel… put a little program to Arduino with: IF (g-force)= (something) THEN switch on brake lights.
Actually, I think the car already has something similar in it - It's just that regen alone doesn't slow you with enough force to apply the brake lights. Here in the USA, we have regulations as to when EV brake lights need to be used when slowing - Some cars which have more aggressive regen than the iMiEV does DO use the brake lights even when the friction brakes are not applied, but the iMiEV regen doesn't reach that threshold

Rather than a mod to activate the brake lights using G force, why not a mod to add a switch to the gear selector which directly activates the brake lights - Press that switch with your hand when you want brake lights and that should give you even more regen, as the car does add extra regen when you lightly press the pedal far enough to activate the brake lights. Such a mod would give you the best of both worlds - Brake lights and extra regen

Myself, I drive the iMiEV in 'B' mode 100% of the time and try to not touch the brake pedal until I need it to come to a complete stop . . . . and I like that our regen doesn't activate the brake lights. Until this car, all my previous vehicles have been equipped with 4 or 5 speed manual transmissions and I most often slow by downshifting, so there's no brake lights used then either - When I sold one car after 160,000 miles (260,000 Kms) it still had the factory brake pads on it, so you can tell I didn't use the brakes like most people do. I do keep an eye on my mirrors and if someone is following too closely, when I begin to slow, I give them a brief flash of my brake lights. I've never been rear ended in more than 50 years of driving and probably 2,000,000 miles

I agree with Joe - Be careful, or your wife may take your iMiEV away from you - I had to buy a second one because it's her very favorite car of all time :D

Don
2012 iMiEV SE Premium, White
2012 iMiEV SE, White
2017 Chevy Volt Premier
2014 Ford Transit Connect XLT SWB wagon, 14,000 miles
1979 Honda CBX six into six

mivanci5
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:43 am
Location: Zagreb, Croatia

Re: New owner/member

Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:55 am

Good point Don.

Maybe I can use free left foot, for that switch. Instead of “clutch”.
Renault Avantime 3.0 24v
Citroen XM 2.1 dt
Citroen C2
Mitshubishi I-Miev
Yamaha XS 400 SE
Kramer 411
Store 402

kiev
Posts: 759
Joined: Sun May 03, 2015 7:15 am
Location: The Heart o' Dixie
Contact: Website

brake light actuators

Sun Mar 18, 2018 9:08 am

Welcome Mario,

i like Don's switch idea, and i like Mario's arduino switch idea too. Maybe i'll build both to play with.

i'm not sure if the brake pedal switch generates a voltage signal proportional to how far it is pressed or if it is just an ON-OFF switch.

For the arduino, there are separate accelerometer boards that can plug in to the arduino board, so no need to use the air bag sensors--just provide one on the arduino. Then it's just a matter to figure out if the brake lights are directly actuated or go thru the EV-ECU driven by a CAN buss command. Or tie it in with the brake pedal switch circuit to fake it out as with Don's idea.
kiev = kenny's innovative electric vehicle

mivanci5
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:43 am
Location: Zagreb, Croatia

Re: brake light actuators

Sun Mar 18, 2018 10:55 am

kiev wrote:Welcome Mario,
i'm not sure if the brake pedal switch generates a voltage signal proportional to how far it is pressed or if it is just an ON-OFF switch.


From part number in Peugeot catalog and how it looks to me, it is plain ON/OFF switch.

Just needs to be parallel connected to Arduino board with G sensor board, or like Dan said to manual switch.

If this on/off signal kicks additional regen, that is great news.

With Arduino board this additional regen would be automatic. Just amplification of normal regen kicked by G sensor via relay. And as bonus, brake light on.

Caution, this will brake only back wheels. On slippery road that can be dangerous, if regen is to strong. But ASR will for sure turn on and try to correct, but for second or two on wet or snow, it will be no fun.

Anyway, it needs to be made and tested, and G sensor calibrated to right trigger force…

On Sparkfun online shop 20$ for boards, I think I will make it also just for fun.
Renault Avantime 3.0 24v
Citroen XM 2.1 dt
Citroen C2
Mitshubishi I-Miev
Yamaha XS 400 SE
Kramer 411
Store 402

JoeS
Site Moderator
Posts: 3537
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:47 am
Location: Los Altos Hills, California

Re: New owner/member

Sun Mar 18, 2018 11:07 am

As Don mentioned, the i-MiEV does not activate its brake light on regen because it does not meet the minimum deceleration threshold (I need to look for the reference spec, but IIRC it is around 0.3g). For this I am thankful because I am miffed by how easily my Tesla turns on its brake light when I ease up on the go-pedal (especially when I see a police car). On the Tesla an over-the-air update added a cute feature to the car's image on the dashboard which shows when the lights and brake lights turn on. It shows that it doesn't take much to activate that brake light on the Tesla and I have to re-learn to drive gently when I get into that car.

Following Teslas, i3s, Bolts, etc., which have brakelight actuation on regen is getting pretty annoying during normal highway driving (many people don't modulate the pedal well) and I wonder if that may spur a change in the regulations.

As far as onboard accelerometers, yes, the i-MiEV's ASC (Active Stability Control) has them, although I don't think anyone has hacked into them yet.

As far as using the brake pedal switch to activate regen: I like the idea of a separate Arduino control circuit. If I recall, there are two switches as well as transducer actuated by the brake pedal - the transducer for sensing brake rate application results in terrific response during an emergency stop. Note Kiev's comment that it all may feed into the EV-ECU. Anyway, I don't recall anyone trying to tap into the brake switch(es) to see if they activate regen, but I would love to hear from you, Mario, or anyone who has experimented with this, as my dream regen control is a paddle mounted by the steering wheel. :geek:
EVs: 2 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 Tesla MS85, 3 156v CorbinSparrows (2 Li-ion), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab 96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
ICE: '88 Isuzu Trooper. Mothballed: '67 Saab (orig.owner), '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

Aerowhatt
Gold Member
Posts: 426
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2015 1:52 pm

Re: New owner/member

Sun Mar 18, 2018 2:47 pm

mivanci5 wrote:Thank you on your welcome JoeS.

One thing that I noticed in past one day of ownership is lack of brake light while on regen braking… NOT COOL Mitsubishi, really not cool. City driving with “B” is not an option in heavy city traffic. May be I’m exaggerating, but I do not like it.

So after brain storm of 5 minutes, and 15 min searching on forum what can be done. I did not find anything (maybe I missed something)… and idea is born… connect G force sensor on Arduino board, and connect it to brake light switch in parallel… put a little program to Arduino with: IF (g-force)= (something) THEN switch on brake lights.

Sure I need to look up in schematics of the car, and see what is most simple solution to connect to it, and to test Arduino and sensor, to see if this is simple enough.

I-Miev for sure has g sensor in airbag system, that can be used, but to hack in that data it will take more time... and when you get data, it needs digital translation to be used for activation of a switch… but it is also an option if airbag g sensor is what I think it must be.

But may be someone allrady solved the problem, or im making to much fuss over nothing?

I like this kind of stuff, but IL need a little time to get familiar with my new car.


Yes I agree! something that I did not like about the car either. I didn't get much interest from the forum on a mod. So I changed my driving habits instead. I decided the best way to do the brake light mod for regen was to use a current sensing coil (at the inverter), then drive a relay to power the brake lights. At a certain threshold of regen the brake lights would light up.

For driving habits in order to avoid the issue. If you go to a calm area of road and get up to a reasonable around town speed. Shift to N and then gently ease the brake pedal down. There is a big area of travel where no braking happens (friction braking). Once you get a feel for the pedal and where friction braking begins. You can maximize regen by using that (friction braking) dead zone in the pedal while the car is in D. Same general result as B mode, but more interaction required on your part. Not for everyone, especially if it is "one pedal" driving you are interested in. I got use to it fast and it became second nature in no time.

I think, in retrospect that one pedal driving creates bad driving habits that can bite you in the butt when driving in other vehicles.

Aerowhatt
2014 cool silver ES, acquired new 4/2015 (42.7ah at ~26K miles)
2014 Labrador Black Pearl ES, acquired new 3/2016 (41.5ah at ~15k miles)

phb10186
Posts: 290
Joined: Fri May 13, 2016 12:58 am
Location: North London suburbs, UK

Re: New owner/member

Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:42 pm

Welcome to the forum mivanci5 - hope you enjoy the car.

This whole 'brake lights on regen' thing is a bit confusing to me. The question I ask is 'what do the brake lights show'? - and that has traditionally been 'accelerator not applied, brakes applied'. So I suppose that it would make sense to have a deceleration threshold applied, irrespective of regen. That does alter the answer to the question to 'car decelerating'... though not arguing either way. I can't see too many circumstances where that could be misleading, but the 'one 'e' pedal' drive like the new Leaf has does suggest to me that the future of 'braking' insofar as the information to other road users is one of rate of deceleration. Sensible.
2012 I-MIEV Keiko Silver 16K
2010 Insight ES-T 43K
2001 Accord Type-V (F23 manual)
2009 Hornet CB600F
2008 SH300

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