jray3
Posts: 1543
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:05 am
Location: Tacoma area, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Fuel costs

Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:03 am

spirit wrote:How much does it cost to recharge at a recharge station? I heard a charge of $2.50 to plug in. Would that not put a dent in the savings?


Hi Spirit,
Here in the Tacoma/Seattle area, a 1 hr minimum ChargePoint session is $1.70, and Blink starts at $2.00 At 3.3 miles/kwh and at least a 3.3 kW charging rate, that's $0.16 to $0.18 per mile for 'fuel'. In comparison to $3.50/gallon gasoline, it's the cost equivalent of 20 mpg, which is about equal to the average economy of the existing US fleet. Coincidence? I think not.
For me, that's a very acceptable price for public charging, especially since my average use of a public charger is an hour or two to get 'over the hump' on a high-mileage day.

BTW- for a 70 mile R/T commute, a top-off charge at work will be essential. What do you use to charge at work?
2012 i-SE "MR BEAN" 91,000 miles
2000 Mazda Miata EV, 78 kW, 17 kWh
1983 Grumman Kurbwatt EV,170 kW, 32 kWh
1983 Mazda RX-7 EV 43 kW 10 kWh
1971 "Karmann Eclectric" EV 240 kW 19 kWh
1965 Karmann Ghia Cabriolet

JoeS
Site Moderator
Posts: 3537
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:47 am
Location: Los Altos Hills, California

Re: Fuel costs

Tue Jun 02, 2015 12:03 pm

From a different thread,
tigger19687 wrote:... At $30 a month for fuel...
This comment prompted me to re-examine what the fuel costs might be for me IF it were not 'free' because of my now fully amortized solar PV system.

My most-recent Time Of Use Pacific Gas & Electric E-7 (grandfathered and highly desirable) baseline summer rates are:
PEAK (noon - 6pm) $0.36/kWh
OFF-PEAK (6pm - noon) $0.11/kWh

I basically shut down everything in my all-electric house (except the refrigerator) between noon and 6pm and, with rare exceptions and because we now have two i-MiEVs, never need to charge during the day.

OK, my i-MiEV averages 4.2 miles/kWh Ref: Measured Wall-to-Wheels Consumption

We average almost exactly 1000 miles/month

Thus, we consume 238.1 kWh/month

Which would cost (if we paid for it) $26.20/month or 2.6¢/mile

Not too far off from tigger19687's $30/mo number.

Nice theoretical exercise in case someone locally asks about 'fuel' costs.
EVs: 2 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 Tesla MS85, 3 156v CorbinSparrows (2 Li-ion), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab 96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
ICE: '88 Isuzu Trooper. Mothballed: '67 Saab (orig.owner), '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

iwatson
Posts: 113
Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2014 11:12 am
Location: Bartlett (Memphis), Tennessee

Re: Fuel costs

Tue Jun 02, 2015 8:47 pm

JoeS wrote:OK, my i-MiEV averages [b]4.2 miles/kWh


Hey JoeS,

I read this in another thread you posted, plus some other imiever's that posted some higher and some lower efficiency figures, so I officially use your estimate in figuring fuel costs. BTW: We also read your post recommending the garmin gps. I went on ebay and bought the one you recommended! We entered 4.2 as our "MPG" and our killowatt/hr rate in place of "fuel price per gallon", so it constantly gives us our cost for miles traveled!

Our electric rate from TVA is just .09 cents a killowatt hour (using that cheap coal) and last month my wife drove her "i" 750 miles....using your 4.2 miles/kwh, our cost for fuel was only $16.07

People in our part of the country (With a few exceptions) are generally clueless about electric cars! Pity, as we have one of the lowest (if not the lowest) electric rates in the country!
2012 Silver Mitsubishi iMiev ES
2012 Raspberry Mitsubishi IMiev SE Premium
2017 Cajun Red Chevrolet Bolt EV Premiere
2011 Viridian Joule Chevrolet Volt Premium
2002 Forest River Sunseeker 3100
2001 Buick LeSabre Custom
1997 Chrysler Town & Country

tigger19687
Posts: 552
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2015 1:19 pm
Location: Bedford/Concord MA

Re: Fuel costs

Wed Jun 03, 2015 5:50 am

Good thread here.
I got that amount from adding up the miles I drive for work plus a few more for going to the store etc.
Then just added up what my Electric costs (not including the basic stuff that is added just for having the service) and it came out to about $30.

WAY better then $300-$400 in Diesel.
[size=85]- Linda
-2017 Chevy Bolt Premier Bright Blue
- 2014 Toyota Prius C, for the Son

JoeS
Site Moderator
Posts: 3537
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:47 am
Location: Los Altos Hills, California

Re: Fuel costs

Thu Apr 26, 2018 11:19 am

Boy, do I love my PV solar!

Just out of curiosity, I checked my latest Pacific Gas and Electric E-6 Rate schedule. In addition to different TOU Peak, Part-Peak, and Off-Peak rates we've had a Tier reduction down to two levels: "Baseline" and "Over 100% of Baseline".

Baseline usage is supposed to be the low-cost basic minimal-use level for a household in a month. Unfortunately, they treat power generation kWh the same way and as soon as I generate enough kWh to get above their baseline number (16.4kWh/day) they charge me at that higher rate even though I got into that category generating and not consuming! Go figure, but I don't mind as the good news is that they pay me back at that higher rate!

So, recognizing that I am always in the "Over 100% of Baseline" category, here are my summer rates:

Peak (1pm to 7pm): 45.7¢/kWh

Partial Peak (10:00am to 1:00pm and 7pm to 9pm): 34.2¢/kWh

Off-Peak (9pm to 10am): 26.5¢/kWh

I've had solar for 12 years, and have always been dollar-positive because the energy I generated was high-valued and resulted in a net $ number in my favor over the course of the year despite being energy negative (which means I consumed more kWh than I generated over the course of the year). Once a year, the utility does the accounting and has zeroed-out the positive dollars I had accrued over the course of the year because I was net energy-negative.

For the first time in this last year I will be a net energy producer which means I will actually get paid! Thanks to our Tesla Nova Scotia 50-day trip last Fall our home consumed a negligible amount while we were gone and we are now both energy-positive as well as dollar-positive! Can't wait to see what the utility ends up paying me in June in terms of ¢/kWh.

OK, so here's the question on the table: since the utility pays me for the electricity, does that mean I have a positive "fuel" cost and I actually make money driving my EV? :geek: :roll:
EVs: 2 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 Tesla MS85, 3 156v CorbinSparrows (2 Li-ion), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab 96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
ICE: '88 Isuzu Trooper. Mothballed: '67 Saab (orig.owner), '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

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