Don
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Re: Modifying the EVSE charger?

Wed May 03, 2017 7:32 am

thomash85715 wrote:The guy in Gilbert AZ who is selling the Duosida aftermarket EVSE for $200 on ebay and CL states that the charger in the car tells the EVSE what rate to operate on L1.
That's not correct. The charger in the car can operate up to about 14 amps on either L1 or L2, but only if the EVSE tells it that it's safe to operate with that much current. Your EVSE is telling the charger it can only provide 8 amps, so the charger is regulated to just 8 amps. Use an EVSE rated for 12 amps and you'll recharge at 12 amps
If he is correct, then putting a EVSE that wants to run at 12A on 120V will not be a successful enterprise.
Ignore what he's telling you - Any EVSE set to operate at 12 amps will have your car (and any other compatible EV) charging at 12 amps
He states that his chevy volt has a dashboard switch or way to choose 8 or 12A on L1 and that if the mitsu charger is set to draw 8, that will be the limit. This is at odds with what you all say on here but I am more inclined to go along with the wisdom here.
He is correct that the 8/12 switch in his Volt would only work at 8 amps if he was using your EVSE. The car can't charge using more amps than the EVSE is rated for, but if the EVSE is rated for 12, his Volt can select either 8 or 12

Long ago you read here about others using various EVSE's set to 6, 8, 10 or 12 amps charging 2012 iMiEV's. What makes you think a 12 amp EVSE won't charge your car at 12 amps . . . . other than the misinformation this guy has told you?

HOW FAST AN EV RECHARGES IS SET BY THE EVSE SUPPLYING THE POWER - THE CAR CAN USE ANY NUMBER OF AMPS UP TO THAT MAXIMUM NUMBER IS CHOOSES . . . . BUT NOT MORE
Plug any brand of EVSE set for 12 amps and your car will charge at 12 amps. The Duosida EVSE will charge your car at max on both L1 and L2, so if that's what you decide to buy, don't worry
2012 iMiEV SE Premium, White
2012 iMiEV SE, White
2014 Ford Transit Connect XLT SWB wagon, 14,000 miles
1994 Miata 60K miles - Soon to be sold
1979 Honda CBX six into six

JoeS
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Re: Modifying the EVSE charger?

Wed May 03, 2017 8:29 am

Up until now, on 120vac all the EVSEs we've been dealing with have themselves only allowed a maximum current draw of 12A, which, at 80%, is the maximum allowable steady-state current draw from a conventional 120vac 15A (NEMA 5-15) circuit.

For this reason, we have not been concerned with higher currents on 120vac.

This Duosida EVSE evidently is pre-set to allow 16A (irrespective of whether it's 120vac or 240vac) and requires a 20A source circuit.

Does anyone know what is the maximum current draw by the i-MiEV on 120vac if the input current is unrestricted by the EVSE ?

Note: we do know that the maximum current draw by the i-MiEV charger on 240vac is around 13A.
EVs: 2 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 Tesla MS85, 3 156v CorbinSparrows (2 Li-ion), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab 96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
ICE: '88 Isuzu Trooper. Mothballed: '67 Saab (orig.owner), '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

thomash85715
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Re: Modifying the EVSE charger?

Wed May 03, 2017 5:19 pm

The vendor for this Duosida is being a bit circumspect about the max rate at L1 hooked to i-MiEV. I totally go with your analysis Don and was mainly just repeating what was just misinformation supplied by this other person to confirm that it was indeed wrong. When I pressed him about what the L1 amp rate would really be on my car, he replied: "forget about L1. Just use L2."
So now I put the question to our group: has anyone put a cheap aftermarket duosida EVSE on their i-MiEV and achieved good L1 results? Would I be the first to try this?
In an insane society a sane man would appear insane.
Acquired 2012 silver ES April 2017.

wmcbrine
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Location: Laurel, MD
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Re: Modifying the EVSE charger?

Wed May 03, 2017 9:12 pm

JoeS wrote:Does anyone know what is the maximum current draw by the i-MiEV on 120vac if the input current is unrestricted by the EVSE ?

I've been told that it's 16 amps. Not verified by me.

16 amps is also supposed to be the max for Level 1 charging according to the j1772 specs. But apparently that limit is widely ignored.

JoeS
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Re: Modifying the EVSE charger?

Wed May 03, 2017 10:04 pm

wmcbrine, thank you for the link - I had forgotten about that thread.

So, if the i-MiEV can draw 16A and the Duosida is fixed to pass-through 16A, then thomash85715 had darn well better have a good 20A protected circuit. Sorry, but plugging the Duosida into a 15A circuit and the car drawing 16A steady-state is asking for trouble - this is what happened at 120vac 16A feeding a Zivan charger (nothing to do with the i-MiEV) -

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thomash85715, don't you have 240vac available?
EVs: 2 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 Tesla MS85, 3 156v CorbinSparrows (2 Li-ion), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab 96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
ICE: '88 Isuzu Trooper. Mothballed: '67 Saab (orig.owner), '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

thomash85715
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Re: Modifying the EVSE charger?

Wed May 03, 2017 10:27 pm

I would not go above 12A. I have a kill a watt at the ready to keep eye on things should I actually get this thing from CZ and build it. I have worked in electronics at TV stations where serious considerations to power flow and dissipation are part of the knowledge base.
Going to L2 for me is complicated. First of all I see no method for L2 for me other than the $300 evse upgrade or the $200+ duosida. And then I would have more work and wiring to do at my carport and adjacent laundry room. This enhanced level 1 DIY device is appealing on many levels to me. It is a fraction of the cost of convert to L2, it is usable at other people's normal outlets should I visit someone. It gives me a feeling of control over my own charging situation instead of just paying other people to run my show. And it speeds charging up from a 120V existing plug. That is assuming it works as advertised.
In an insane society a sane man would appear insane.
Acquired 2012 silver ES April 2017.

Don
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Re: Modifying the EVSE charger?

Thu May 04, 2017 10:07 am

thomash85715 wrote:I would not go above 12A. I have a kill a watt at the ready to keep eye on things . . . . .
I think Joe's warning was if you bought the Duosida which is set for 16 amps L1 and doesn't appear to be adjustable. If you were to buy that you wouldn't be able to limit it to 12 amps even if you wanted to

If your plans are to keep the car for a long time, the EVSE Upgrade is not a bad deal. If you have electrical knowledge (and you say you do) converting an existing outlet from 120 volts to 240 volts isn't that difficult and it's really inexpensive to do. If your laundry room is near your carport, it's usually pretty simple to get 240 by tapping into the dryer circuit - You may not be able to charge and dry clothes at the same time, but that's not a big deal. It is also possible to recharge with 240 volts by using two 120 volt outlets which are fed by different phases. Stick one lead of your voltmeter on the 'hot' pin of both outlets - You'll either get zero volts (if both outlets are on the same phase) or 240 volts if the two hot pins are fed by opposite phases. You make up a junction box with a pair of 120 volt cords which plug into the outlets and you get 240 volts out of the box to feed your EVSE

The nice thing about the EVSE Upgrade is you can take it with you anywhere and with a set of pigtails you can recharge just about anywhere, from any type of outlet, many times using 240 volts. A $10 or $15 pigtail will allow you to plug it into just about any electrical outlet, anywhere

Don
2012 iMiEV SE Premium, White
2012 iMiEV SE, White
2014 Ford Transit Connect XLT SWB wagon, 14,000 miles
1994 Miata 60K miles - Soon to be sold
1979 Honda CBX six into six

justoneman
Posts: 76
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:09 pm

Re: EVSE Upgrade

Tue May 09, 2017 6:32 pm

thomash85715 wrote:A guy in Gilbert AZ on ebay is offering the duosida for $200 though I can't tell if has them or is backordering or what. I put a question to him asking if it is user programmable for various amps on 120vac. Not answered yet.
One thing I don't get though...is a US early i-miev limited to 8 amp charge by some setting in the EVSE it came with or is it something in its onboard charger commanding the EVSE to stay at 8? I believe I have seen statements on here and elsewhere the canadian cars charge at 12A from 120vac sockets. Which box is that happening in? Point is that if it is programmed into our USA chargers, then a duosida is not going to do anything but charge at 8A on a USA car. What am I missing here?

I have a Duosida EVSE. Its a 16amp 240. It has a 20 amp plug type I have the 20 amp outlet type. I made a 10AWG extension for it and a conversion whip to use on a standard 10amp outlet type. It seems to charge pretty fast for me at both of my charging locations with these two different outlet types. Its waterproof and I am very happy with its performance.


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justoneman
Posts: 76
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Re: EVSE Upgrade

Tue May 09, 2017 6:35 pm

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justoneman
Posts: 76
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:09 pm

Re: EVSE Upgrade

Tue May 09, 2017 6:36 pm

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