Use of Level 1 Charger and Charging Indicator; Thread # 9

Hello out there. As you may know, I am a new Miev owner here in San Antonio,TX. I have only done one charge up to a full 16 bars. My questions centers around the charging indicator light on the instrument cluster and the orange charging indicator light on the manufacturer provided Level 1 charger. I did not use the remote control capability to do the charge. I began the charge and periodically checked the energy level gauge and noticed the bars rising. When it reached 16 bars I checked the orange light on the Level 1 charger and it was still illuminated. In time the orange light on the Level 1 charger went out, and I figured the battery conditioning process was over. So I checked the red charging indicator light and observed it was still illuminated. I waited awhile, and no change to the charging indicator light on the instrument cluster. I then disconnected the Level 1 charger, and the instrument cluster light went out. Page 1-25 of the owner's manual states the charging indicator light goes out when charging is complete. The question is this: Should I have waited longer before I disconnected the Level 1 charger? When the orange light on the Level 1 charger goes out, does that mean charging is complete and the battery has gone through its conditioning and balancing processes? Any thoughts/advice is appreciated. Bill Thompson.

I haven't paid much attention to the lights...but I do use a Kill-o-Watt, and it will tell you exactly how many watts/amps are being used at any moment, as well as other things. With the J plug not even plugged into the car, the charger draws 3 watts...so you can monitor anything over that and observe the charging process go through it's paces relative to the lights on the charger.

Good question Bill - I'm not sure about the light on the dash . . . . never paid much attention, but the orange light on the charger indicates when the relay in it is closed, so when that light goes out, the charging process is over, as there is no current flowing to the car any longer

BTW - The 3 watt 'vampire drain' that fjpod mentioned is reduced by about 90% when you have the EVSE upgraded - It sill draws a tiny bit of current when left plugged into the wall, but it's much less than 3 watts. Like many others, I never unplug mine

Don

Bill, I also haven't paid much attention to correlating the dash charging light going out relative to the EVSE amber light. Quite often during the charging cycle the onboard charger turns off the input for exactly ten minutes (I see this on my TED monitor). I hypothesize that this is the BMS checking the individual cell voltages to see how much they've dropped prior to resuming charge (a normal procedure in more sophisticated chargers, even lead-acid chargers). After the ten-minute timeout it resumes charging normally. I wouldn't be surprised if during this ten-minute time-out the amber light on the EVSE goes out and yet the dashboard charging indicator still stays on. I'll try to pay attention and see if I can catch this. Certainly nothing to be concerned about. Yes, after it's fully fully charged and balanced, the amber light on the EVSE goes out, leaving only the steady green light.

I think Joe answered your question, Bill. You were running in and out of the garage checking it so often (newbie EV'er complex ) that you caught it in that ten minute 'break' and you unplugged it. No harm done . . . . it doesn't really need the full BMS evaluation very often anyway

Don

Bill,

The charging light on the dash does go out as well as the fuel gauge when fully charged, so your i was not done charging when you inplugged.

UPDATE-- Thanks for all the comments and advice. Here is the bottom line. I had five bars on the energy gauge. Using the suggested formula of dividing the number of bars to be charged by .8 results in projected charging time of 13.75 hours using the OEM Level 1 charger. At 12 hours into the charge the gauge read 16 bars. Orange charger light and instrument cluster charging light still illuminated. At 13 hours gauge still read the expected 16 bars, and both orange and instrument cluster lights still illuminated. At 13.75 hours both lights were extinguished and I disconnected the Level 1 charger. I had driven 49.7 miles with about 30% on interstate highways, and A/C on about 90% of the time. Interstate speeds were kept at 50-55MPH. RR prior to charge was 29 w/o A/C and 27 RR with A/C. After charge the RR with no A/C read 87. Electricity costs here in San Antonio is under $.10/KWHr. Cost to fill to 16 bars at $.10/KWHr was $1.38 (13.75 hrs x $.10). Cost per mile was $.028 (1.38 divided by 49.7 miles). Not a bad start.

Bill, congratulations for such efficient driving, as evidenced by your RR=87 after fully charging! You don't have far to go to beat TaosEV's present record of RR=103.

Your cost/mile is actually better than you calculated. Charging using your Level 1 EVSE draws 900W from the wall. The last hour which the charger spends balancing the cells reduces that number to, say, an average of less than 600W. Thus, using your 13.75hr chargetime and electric rate of $0.10/kWh means (12.75*0.9+1.0*0.6)*0.10/49.7=2.4¢/mile.

Is the 900 watts is an actual observation from your wattmeter Joe? Mine showed more (975 to 980) before I upgraded it

I get a kick out of switching on the key after a recharge - I'm getting pretty good at predicting what the new number will be based on how and where I drove it during the last session. 87 has been my very best too . . . . 64 the worst. I think with our flat terrain around here, that 103 number might be in jeopardy once the A/C season is over

Don

Don said:

Is the 900 watts is an actual observation from your wattmeter Joe? Mine showed more (975 to 980) before I upgraded it

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Yes, Don, measured 906W at almost exactly 120vac, with pretty good corroboration between T.E.D. and Kill-A-Watt. Suspect this number changes with line voltage as the input current probably stays constant. Power factor is close to unity. Dunno if it changes with battery temperature.

My apologies, Joe - I went back and reread my notes and I never had my OEM EVSE on the wattmeter before I had it upgraded. My recollection was for another unit that I tested. With the not so gradual decline in functioning brain cells I'm dealing with lately, I should never 'speak' without checking my notes first!

Don

UPDATE: Please see my post of 5 Aug 12. I also did this charge with the OEM charger without the remote. Bars remaining was 4; RR was 23 and 21 with the A/C. Drove 60.9 miles with A/C on about 90% of the time and interstate highway driving in town of about 31 miles with speeed about 50-55 MPH. So I achieved about 5.08 miles per bar. To do full charge to 16 bars (added 12 bars) took 15 hours. The formula of number of bars to charge divided by .8 is right on the money. At my cost of electricity ($.10/KwHr), the cost was $1.50. My cost per mile was $.02.5. So far I have driven 118.2 miles, and have spent $3.18 on electricity. So my cost per mile is $.02.69. This is not bad. RR after this charge was 89 and with A/C on was 83.
As an aside, my previous car was a 2006 Honda Civic Hybrid. I kept close track of fuel economy with that car and I had a lifetime MPG rating of 50.4 MPG. To drive the same distance as the MIEV would have been 2.345 gallons of gas; gas costs about $3.35/gallon here, so cost per mile with the Hybrid would have been about $.06.64 per mile. The MIEV is almost 2.5 times more efficient than the Hybrid.

My used imiev charged fully has a range of 75km
That's not even 50 miles
Could there be something wrong with the battery or is driving around town more of a drain
I have spoken to salesman and have been told that this is just an average figure
Isn't the range supposed to be up to and around 90 miles
And how do you change the RR to miles instead of kilometres

Welcome to the group Sheky

I usually get 115 km (71.5 miles) or more after a full charge on the RR meter
Now that's after having done a lot of up hill driving - 5 km (3 miles) to get home.
This is in warm weather not using ac or heat. My Miev has about 8,000 km (5,000 miles)

Where are you located? , how used is your I Miev?, & how do you charge, (Equipment, time?)
Driving around town should get you the best mile age. Highway speeds get you less range.

Sandy

Sheky said:

Isn't the range supposed to be up to and around 90 miles
And how do you change the RR to miles instead of kilometres

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Hello and welcome to the forum.

90 miles RR would be on the high end of things, and as Sandy said, it would be in city driving that you would see RR's in this neighborhood. While hypermiling isn't necessary to get 90, it would require gentle acceleration and no heat or A/C.

Although I occasionally see 90 miles RR, typically I'm closer to 70. Average in the last month has been 75 miles. I've been tracking it for a month and plan to do so over the winter to see what the weather does. My driving cycle is mostly "suburban" trying to keep the car under 45 when possible.

As they say, your mileage may vary- if you're using heat or A/C knock 15 miles off that, and if you drive with a hot foot, well, drop some more.

To answer your question on the meter, press the display button repeatedly until you bring up the main (not the trip) odometer. Press and HOLD the button for a couple seconds- you should see the speedometer change to miles (it must have been reading in km/h if your RR is in km). Release the button and cycle through to RR and it should now be in miles.

Hope that helps.

Rich