joev
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Location: Long Island, NY

US to create nationwide network of EV charging stations

Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:08 am

The US government has announced "an unprecedented set of actions" to pump up the country's plug-in electric vehicle market, including US$4.5 billion in loan guarantees to create a nationwide network of commercial scale and fast charging stations. The initiative to push for greater electric car adoption calls for a collaboration between federal and state agencies, utilities, major automakers and other groups. The initiative will identify zero emission and alternative fuel corridors across the country, to determine the best locations to put in fast charging stations, as part of the Fixing America's Surface Transportation (FAST) Act. As part of a partnership between the US departments of energy ...

http://www.gizmag.com/ev-charging-stati ... tes/44522/

PV1
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Re: US to create nationwide network of EV charging stations

Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:30 am

Nice to get some support from up top.

One question, though. How do they propose 350 kW charging? None of the 3 DCQC connectors can handle that kind of amperage. Even with 800 volt battery packs, that is still 437 amps :shock: . People are worried now about the impact on the grid from the 50 kW units.

I suppose they are picturing EVs with 290 kWh battery packs, which will deliver about a 1,000 mile range. Then a 350 kW DCQC would deliver a charge appropriate for the battery size, but it's still totally unnecessary. With a pack that large, the smallest charger that would make sense is a 50 kW unit, which'll still take 6 hours for a full charge.

I don't see the need for anything more than what a Model S 90D can deliver. Isn't 294 miles EPA enough? I've been stretching my 62-mile battery over 2-3 days before charging lately. How about instead of making batteries (and as a result, the charging equipment) larger, why don't we continue to make vehicles more efficient and lighter?
"Bear" - 2012 Diamond White Pearl ES with QC - 2/21/2013
Solar-powered since 10/10/2013

"Koorz" - 2012 Cool Silver Metallic ES with QC - 1/5/2015

2017 Bolt EV LT in Orange with QC - 7/31/2017

Driving electric since 2-21-2013.

mdbuilder
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Re: US to create nationwide network of EV charging stations

Tue Jul 26, 2016 7:47 am

Well, there is also this

"Essentially, the loan guarantees are designed to help finance the types of new technologies and innovative projects that typically have trouble finding commercial funding in the US, enabling them to deploy at a commercial scale."

Which is pretty comical. With interest rates near zero any commercial project that has any sort of business case at all can get funded. Only projects with no economic hope of making a profit ever need a loan guarantee. :D

The 350Kw thing makes slightly more sense. Not to install actual chargers with that spec but when you are trenching in the cables put the power availability in now so if you need it later it is available. But again, a loan guarantee? What chance is it the loan will ever get paid back...
2015 Nissan NV200
2012 I-Miev SE Premium
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2017 Toyota Prius Prime

JoeS
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Re: US to create nationwide network of EV charging stations

Tue Jul 26, 2016 10:51 am

mdbuilder wrote:... a loan guarantee? What chance is it the loan will ever get paid back...
I agree with you, as the only business case I've seen that makes sense is sponsorship by, e.g., a shopping center - which I guess would fall into the realm of marketing/advertising expense.

Higher power: for BEV/PHEV trucks? Present large truck stops already have the infrastructure.

As an aside, the few gas-station DCQC locations I have gone to have STUNK - having weened myself off gas and diesel, I now find myself really sensitive to those carcinogenic fumes, especially outside of California (California gas station fueling nozzles have vapor-recovery).

Re: charging rate: during our cross-country Tesla trip, I often wished that I could dial-down the DCQC charging rate (to reduce the hit on the battery) as almost always the car was ready to go before we were; nevertheless, there are times when bigger and faster is better, especially when there is a queue waiting to charge.

"Another interesting part of the initiative is the Battery500 research consortium led by the Pacific Northwest National Laboratory, which will receive up to $10 million per year for five years to develop a cheaper, lighter and more powerful battery."
Sounds like a boondoggle to me - isn't Tesla doing that on their own (with Panasonic)?
EVs: 2 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 Tesla MS85, 3 156v CorbinSparrows (2 Li-ion), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab 96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
ICE: '88 Isuzu Trooper. Mothballed: '67 Saab (orig.owner), '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

mdbuilder
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Location: Great Mills, Md.

Re: US to create nationwide network of EV charging stations

Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:37 am

On the other hand, if anyone wants to blow some dollars installing a DCQC or two 20 miles south of the corridor they are currently plentiful in around here. Say 1/2 way between my house and Annapolis <g>. I'm all for it. Currently the DCQC's are mostly 50-60 miles from my house and about 20 degrees off the direction I want to travel to, fairly useless to me. I'd have to slo cruise my way to the charger which is 20 or 30 miles out of the way and slo cruise to the destination to have enough charge to make it back...
2015 Nissan NV200
2012 I-Miev SE Premium
2009 Mazda 5
2017 Toyota Prius Prime

PV1
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Re: US to create nationwide network of EV charging stations

Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:58 am

Plug spacing works pretty well for travelling north up until Slippery Rock for me. I can't really go much more north than that right now. I need a QC near New Stanton to connect me to the mid-PA quick chargers, and a QC in Triadelphia/Wheeling WV would be nice to go west. A nicer Nissan dealer to the south would be a bonus :roll: .

I wonder which units will be installed under this program.
"Bear" - 2012 Diamond White Pearl ES with QC - 2/21/2013
Solar-powered since 10/10/2013

"Koorz" - 2012 Cool Silver Metallic ES with QC - 1/5/2015

2017 Bolt EV LT in Orange with QC - 7/31/2017

Driving electric since 2-21-2013.

mdbuilder
Posts: 226
Joined: Wed May 18, 2016 6:05 am
Location: Great Mills, Md.

Re: US to create nationwide network of EV charging stations

Tue Jul 26, 2016 2:39 pm

I would hope like the combo nrevgo machines. 1 chademo + 1SAE combo. Tesla can buy the adapter <g>.
2015 Nissan NV200
2012 I-Miev SE Premium
2009 Mazda 5
2017 Toyota Prius Prime

jray3
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Re: US to create nationwide network of EV charging stations

Tue Jul 26, 2016 2:50 pm

Yes, structuring it as loan guarantees rather than grants seems a fallacy designed to create a Blink-style cash grab, where the executives cash out while deploying a lot of subpar equipment, and in the process- crippling EVSE networks that have a better chance of viability. I hope the Feds manage to tweak the terms to prevent this scenario. I will both welcome and demand performance from any new EVSE.
2012 i-SE "MR BEAN" 76,000 miles
i-ES traded at 21,648 miles
2000 Honda Odyssey
1987 F250 Diesel
1983 Grumman Kurbwatt,170 kW, 32 kWh
1983 Mazda RX-7 EV 43 kW 10 kWh
1971 "Karmann Eclectric" EV 240 kW 19 kWh
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rmay635703
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Re: US to create nationwide network of EV charging stations

Wed Jul 27, 2016 12:51 pm

Try to travel north of Madison or Milwaukee Wisconsin once, only public stuff is at Kwik trips and L1

On my trip to Niagara, I only had 2 real opportunities to charge, both L1 as well.

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