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phb10186

Well-known member
Joined
May 13, 2016
Messages
325
Location
North London suburbs, UK
Are you British, or do you just love us?

We could end up being the 51st state if we vote to leave the EU tomorrow... hmm then we would have to listen to Trump more/ possibly have him as a leader.
 
:lol:

European mutt heritage, Scottish, Irish, German, French, Dutch, and who knows what else!

I rather hope that you stay in the EU. I think it would be better in promoting electrification. Don't know enough about anything else tho.
 
Phximiev said:
:lol:

European mutt heritage, Scottish, Irish, German, French, Dutch, and who knows what else!

I rather hope that you stay in the EU. I think it would be better in promoting electrification. Don't know enough about anything else tho.

Probably better to keep non-EV politics out of the forum - but our vote on remaining or leaving the EU is obviously a black/white decision. Most people are however very marginally above or below a middle shade of gray, like me.

It's actually the most democratic moment in my lifetime, as you aren't voting for some clown in a sharp suit to tell you what's good for you, but rather a constitutional change based on what your ideals of democracy, sovereignty and law-making are.

Its not going to be the end of the world either way - but it is going to divide the country in half - but it already was anyway.

The campaign on both sides has been horrible - mainly personal, immigration biased, and completely lacking in any requisite data and statistics... funny for politicians to do that.

There is also a very good debate that is titled something like 'size of the economy does not correlate well at all to the individuals quality of life'.

If we do leave, we will undoubtedly drop from our current ranking of 5th largest global economy - a statistic that I still find amazing in 2016. Also, apparently, due to our fairly high personal taxes (the UK is of course a corporate tax haven, but very much not a personal one), we are financially worse off by income per capita than all US states except Alabama - which again is a truly amazing stat - but then of course these are averages based on established land borders.

When you look at a politician like Boris Johnson, one has to grin at the hilarity of the state we are in, but then you've got a Donald.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00MvVIVR38k
 
But . . . . I think I heard on CNN this morning that the voter turnout is expected to be 85%!! We've *never * seen anything close to that on this side of the pond - Everybody loves to moan and complain, but few of them seem to have the time or inclination to go to the polls to make their wishes *official*. Sadly, 30 or 35% is about the norm over here

But them we can have an issue 90% of all Americans are in favor of (No fly, No buy for example) and that won't even come up for a vote in our congress! Of the people, by the people, for the people went by the wayside long ago

Don
 
Don said:
But . . . . I think I heard on CNN this morning that the voter turnout is expected to be 85%!! We've *never * seen anything close to that on this side of the pond - Everybody loves to moan and complain, but few of them seem to have the time or inclination to go to the polls to make their wishes *official*. Sadly, 30 or 35% is about the norm over here

But them we can have an issue 90% of all Americans are in favor of (No fly, No buy for example) and that won't even come up for a vote in our congress! Of the people, by the people, for the people went by the wayside long ago

Don

I think 85% registered to vote, but that doesn't mean all of them actually vote. I'll be interested to see what the final turnout is. The bets are on remain.
 
phb10186 said:
Also, apparently, due to our fairly high personal taxes (the UK is of course a corporate tax haven, but very much not a personal one), we are financially worse off by income per capita than all US states except Alabama - which again is a truly amazing stat - but then of course these are averages based on established land borders.
I'm pretty sure you guys are way better off than Alabama.

The biggest difference is that your taxes pay for your health care, ours don't.
 
wmcbrine said:
phb10186 said:
Also, apparently, due to our fairly high personal taxes (the UK is of course a corporate tax haven, but very much not a personal one), we are financially worse off by income per capita than all US states except Alabama - which again is a truly amazing stat - but then of course these are averages based on established land borders.
I'm pretty sure you guys are way better off than Alabama.

The biggest difference is that your taxes pay for your health care, ours don't.

Behold... maybe BS:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2014/08/25/britain-is-poorer-than-any-us-state-yes-even-mississippi/#64d8a3883fab

And the argument, which explains that high costs of living is the driver:

http://time.com/3198225/britain-poorest-state/

Yeah, can't argue with the healthcare benefits one bit, as wasteful as it is (estimates are about 40-50% of total), it is orders of magnitude more efficient against the shambollically inefficient US model... Note I did not mention anything about quality, because we all know that the cutting edge of medicine is delivered in the US... it just costs a fair bit.

Hence our fuel is about 8 US per gallon... not that I care about that anymore. However, living costs in London these days are ludicrous, thus I am mortgaged to the hilt and essentially a wage slave for the benefits of the establishment etc.

Lastly, let's not forget that despite the pictures of Big Ben and Buckingham Palace and all the Queens Rolls Royce's, there is a huge amount of income disparity, and a lot of poor areas that don't feature on many postcards or Facebook pages.
 
Thanks for the separate topic.

The more light-hearted side of the issue: http://www.newsday.com/opinion/cartoons-brexit-and-the-future-of-europe-1.11958009
 
Must have.

From the news this am, it appears that some of the Brexit folks have regrets over the fall out.
 
Another referendum: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/06/25/more-than-1-6-million-brits-signed-a-petition-for-another-referendum-they-shouldnt-hold-their-breath/
 
Blimey, its a bit of a storm here at the moment. The people have spoken and it's uncertain times ahead. Pretty sure things will stability in a month or so, and hopefully we emerge from this in a stronger position, if we play our cards right. We have our sovereignty back, I just hope we get the leadership capability to negotiate out of a road fulL of obstacles ahead.

You could compare this in Imiev terms to filling it with 4 people and embarking on a 2000 mile journey with ChAdeMO points every 75 miles, with only one working headlight and no A/C, nails in the road at every corner... do you get there?

Can't be anything other than exciting times ahead, but depends how much of a risk taker you are. We have as a nation, stuck 2 fingers on both hands up at the political establishment, and the unelected and not democratic enough EU.

Both main political parties imploding, but as far as I can see everyone us still alive, and there is plenty of electricity to go round still!

Was it a good idea? Well we were all in the 45-55% area it just tipped to out. Would have been ok either way, the status quo was OK, but noone could argue that the status quo needed to change, the tipping point was the arrogance of the establishment, and a bet that didn't go theor way.

I hope our Scottish and Northern Irish friends stick with us, but if they don't, there is nothing that can be done, and the democratic decision would have to be respected. Unfortunately, I would expect the prices for good Scotch to rise if they do.
 
JoeS said:
Near-term, effect on petrol and diesel prices -

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-36621927

"…the plunge in the value of the pound against the dollar would have an immediate impact, as wholesale fuel prices are quoted in dollars."

Good for EVs?

One thing's for sure, this Referendum assures full employment for bureaucrats as they try to unscramble this mess.


Good for EVs... Yes likely. Full employment for beurocrats... yup, there are going to be a lot of lobster dinners that are going to need eating over the next 2 years.
 
Personally, I am comforted by the fact that most of the developed world hasn't call in the liquidators - the £, although at 31 year lows 3 days after this thing is bad, it isn't game-changingly bad in any way.

Nothing like a good old-fashioned peasants revolt. All we need is the US to keep on patting us on the back, and we may even emerge stronger at some point in a few years.

This is so much more fun than the US presidential campaign is this time round.
 
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